Bava Metzia 048: Do the Bath Houses give out Towels or not?

[Kollel Iyun Hadaf]

x-mailing-list: daf-disc...@shemayisrael.com
(Please include header and footer when redistributing this material.)
_________________________________________________________________

                 THE DAFYOMI DISCUSSION LIST

      brought to you by Kollel Iyun Hadaf of Yerushalayim
             Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
                      d...@dafyomi.co.il

 [REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE TO DISCUSS THE DAF WITH THE KOLLEL]
________________________________________________________________

Bava Metzia 048: Do the Bath Houses give out Towels or not?

alex lebovits asked:

The Gem. speaks about a 'Balon" as a transaction for a service which has 
nothing to make a meshicha on.
But didn't we just learn a Blatt before in Rashi that an 'asimon' is used in a 
bath house to keep track of how many towels are needed. What is the difference 
between a barber and his scissors to a bath-house and its towels?
Thank you for considering my question.

Kol Tuv
Alex Lebovits, Toronto, Canada
----------------------------------------------
The Kollel replies:

(1) A “Balan” is actually the term used for the person who washes people in the 
bath-house i.e. “Balan” is the name of a profession.

The point about the Balan is that he does not seem to have any special tools of 
his trade. This is the difference between him and the barber who has scissors 
as his work tools. Therefore “Meshichah” can be done by the person who wishes 
to have his hair cut, pulling the scissors of the barber into his domain and 
this way the barber now becomes obliged to cut his customer’s hair. This 
Meshichah of the scissors is a totally valid Kinyan, and similarly for a Balan, 
who has no tools, the only way he can be hired is by giving him money.

(2) The Asimon does not affect a transaction at all. This is already hinted at 
in the words of the Gemara that the Asimon is given as a “Siman”  for the 
bath-house. A Siman is a sign, and this suggests that the Asimon is only an 
indicator of how many people are going to be washing but the Asimon does not 
actually make a transaction. (Because the Asimon does not make a Kinyan this is 
probably also why a low quality kind of coin – as Rashi  47b DH ha'Nitonos 
describes them – is used.) Rashi also writes that when the Balan knows how many 
people will be in the bath-house he knows how much water to heat up and how 
many towels to prepare. This also indicates that the Balan has no other tools 
to prepare for his work so it seems that he helps people to wash with his bare 
hands or possibly they wash themselves and the Balan merely prepares the 
bath-house by heating up the water etc.

(It also would appear that they did not use soap to wash because otherwise 
Rashi should have written that the Balan would know how much soap to prepare. )

Again, the towel is not considered a tool of the Balan because the bathers do 
not require the help of the professional to dry themselves off after the bath. 
In contrast the scissors of the barber are tools of an expert and when one 
performs a Kinyan on them this means he now has to cut one’s  hair.

KOL TUV
Dovid Bloom 


 >>><><><>><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><<<
The *D*AFYOMI *A*DVANCEMENT *F*ORUM, brought to you by Kollel Iyun Hadaf
Write to us at d...@dafyomi.co.il or visit us at http://www.dafyomi.co.il
Fax(US):(206) 202-0323; Fax(Isr): (02) 591-6024; Tel(Isr): (02) 651-5004  


_______________________________________________
Daf-discuss mailing list
Daf-discuss@shemayisrael.co.il
http://shemayisrael.co.il/mailman/listinfo/daf-discuss_shemayisrael.co.il