I am so happy for you and for Curly, and thrilled that your vet has recognized
the usefulness of “Zander’s Protocol” in treating FeLV cats. Though I lost my
precious little boy just a little over two years ago, his stoic tolerance of me
monitoring him so closely and studying his blood work results, allowed me to
figure out some of this stuff. I want to recognize his bravery and refusal to
give up, when really, things were very grim. When his haematocrit dropped to
FIVE, after the FeLV crash, he was lying motionless under the oxygen tent and
everyone was telling me it was time to let him go. It was only because, when I
called his name that he emphatically wagged his tail, and kept doing it every
time I said his name, that reinforced for me that he was in there and
listening, and I wasn’t about to give up on him.
In looking at Curly’s very rapid heamatocrit recovery, versus the much more
prolonged one with Zander and others who have shared their experiences in this
forum, I am going to hypothesize again that perhaps the sooner that an FeLV cat
gets on Zander’s Protocol, the faster the reversal happens, if it is going to
happen. With Zander, it was at least three months before I put him on the
Winstrol – he was already on the Doxy and Prednisone from before. In the three
months (or more) between his FeLV crash and when I decided to try the Winstrol,
I had tried other things like interferon and the LTCI injections, and nothing
had worked at all. Perhaps the longer the virus has to attack the bone marrow,
the more depleted the bone marrow gets and the harder it is for the Winstrol to
have a positive effect on the it.
With respect to taking Curley off the meds in a month, again, I did this very
much by trial and error with Zander. I would try to wean him off, and would
check his blood work with every attempt to reduce the medication. Any worsened
lab results (red cells, neutrophils, lymphocytes, platelets, reticulocytes,
haematocrit) and I would up the medication again. I found that there was an
immediate slippage of his results, every time I tried to wean him off (which
again, supported the belief that the improved results were related to the
medication given, since attempts to reduce the medication had an immediate
negative impact on the results – part of the scientific principle). This lasted
10 months or so. I suggest the same “play it by ear” approach for Curly. Try
weaning Curly off, with close bloodwork monitoring. If her results hold, you’re
good to go. Otherwise, resume the protocol.
Zander had much worse liver enzyme results than you’re reporting. I don’t have
the results off-hand, but my recollection is that the results for all the liver
enzymes (AST, ALT, LD, TBili, DBili) were all significantly increased. I am
guessing but I seem to recall that ALT would have been in the 500-800 range. It
all disappeared when the Winstrol was discontinued after 10 months, and I never
had problems with his liver in all the times I tested him after his recovery.
Your vet is correct to just leave things well enough alone for now.
I am delighted at your vet’s response. This is what I would hope and expect
from all vets. Try out the protocol, run before and after blood work, and then
decide if it works or not. Simple. Keep politics and taboos out of it. Ignore
the red herring of the liver enzymes because what’s the point in safe-guarding
the liver if the cat isn’t going to survive the viral attack? If the protocol
doesn’t work, then stop. Ideally, there should be no delay in getting started
with Zander’s protocol, because (a) why let the cat get more and more
debilitated before you start the treatment – the treatment may not be
sufficient to pull the cat back out of the abyss if you wait too long and (b)
if it isn’t going to work, you have to move on to other options, again, as
quickly as possible. Others have not had success with Zander’s protocol, and so
it may be that different strains of the virus are responsible for the fact that
the protocol works very effectively, in a relatively short period of time, with
some cats, but not others.
From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Randy
Sent: January-26-17 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Curly's gradual improvement
Curly's latest labs from yesterday show another hematocrit leap from 15% to 23%
in 2 1/2 weeks. She has also gained 6/10 of a pound! (7.1 up from 6.5).
Behaviorally she is almost back to her old self. She is no longer hiding, seeks
out attention and is eating well. Our vet told us he is astounded. But more
importantly, he said that he is changing his treatment for FELV cats based on
Curly's remarkable improvement and will be using Prednisone, Winstrol and
Doxycyline in the future. A small win for our side against this disease.
Her blood chemistry test did show that her ALT levels have risen to 174 which
is an indicator that liver cells are being destroyed. Our vet said it is
definitely a result of the anabolic steroid but he isn't overly concerned yet.
H wants us to continue treatment for another month. Once Curly's hematocrit is
up to around 30 he wants to start cycling the Winstrol, one week on and one
week off, to give her liver a chance to regenerate.
Without this forum and the advice I received here along with a very
understanding and open-minded vet, I'm quite sure Curly wouldn't be around
anymore. I have my fingers crossed that we can keep things balanced and headed
in the right direction but so far, so good!
On Sun, Jan 22, 2017 at 12:23 PM, Amani Oakley
Hopefully, we start winning the vets over when they see the results, and they
start to tell each other about some success for FeLV cats with this
combination. By the way, I have also effectively used this combination for a
cat who, I believe had FIV, and I currently am using just the Doxy/Winstrol
combination on 2 of 3 kittens we picked up from the side of the road in August
and they displayed the symptoms of Lyme Disease (alternating lameness and other
signs). In the last case, I am pretty sure that the majority of the effect on
the Lyme organism (Borrelia bergdorferi) is from the Doxycycline, but the good
effect on the lameness (which had been in place for several months before I
thought to try the medications) is I believe as a result of the use of the
When the vets tell me that (a) they don’t know what the diagnosis is and other
options seem ineffective or (b) they tell me there is no hope, I will usually
try the Winstrol and almost always get a decent result.
On Behalf Of Randy Henke
Sent: January-22-17 11:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Curly's gradual improvement
Amani, you asked what our vet thought about Curly's improvement. He was very
pleased but I think he was also a little surprised. He is an incredible vet and
always goes the extra mile to listen and explain things. He was also very open
to letting us try the Prednisolone, Doxy and Winstrol, even though he'd never
treated a FELV cat in that way. I think he thought it would help put my mind at
ease that we'd tried everything we could and he's right. It would have done
that even if the treatment hadn't worked. He was very concerned about the
Prednisolone opening her up to secondary infections but once he saw the numbers
start to improve he was convinced we were doing the right thing and told us to
keep it up. I am going to talk to him about continuing the Doxy.
Robert, that's a great idea about crushing the Doxy, mixing it in broth and
administering with a syringe. We'd tried mixing it in her food once and that
did not go well. Obviously it's a very nasty tasting medicine.
Ardy and Katherine, thanks for your support. I really wish that more vets were
open to trying novel treatments that hold so much potential instead of assuming
that they know everything.
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