Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-08-03 Thread Gregory Sanders
Peter I was curious if you could detail what specific concerns Adam Back brought up with the current iteration of the tree-chains idea? It's been alluded to a few times yet I have not read the specific problem. Greg

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-04-17 Thread Tier Nolan
How does this system handle problems with the lower chains after they have been locked-in? The rule is that if a block in the child chain is pointed to by its parent, then it effectively has infinite POW? The point of the system is that a node monitoring the parent chain only has to watch the

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-28 Thread Troy Benjegerdes
Anyway the particular situation in which a single entity controls 40% of the hashing power should be rare. That's potentially dangerous for bitcoin and although changing the hashing algorithm would be painful and risky, I would be terribly scared of that happening if I was that entity.

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-27 Thread Jorge Timón
I'll make sure I understand your proposal better before commenting much on it, but at a first glance, I don't see how it is incompatible with 2 way peg and merged mining itself. Why wouldn't you want merged mining for the root of your tree? A miner could only chose a leaf block at a time, but it

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Peter Todd
On Sat, Mar 22, 2014 at 12:43:34PM -0700, Mark Friedenbach wrote: Btw, any chance we could get a summary description of tree-chains posted to bitcoin-development? Sure: Introduction Bitcoin doesn't scale. There's a lot of issues at hand here, but the most fundemental of them is

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Gavin Andresen
On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org wrote: Bitcoin doesn't scale. There's a lot of issues at hand here, but the most fundemental of them is that to create a block you need to update the state of the UTXO set, and the way Bitcoin is designed means that updating that

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Peter Todd
On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 08:28:51AM -0400, Peter Todd wrote: On Sat, Mar 22, 2014 at 12:43:34PM -0700, Mark Friedenbach wrote: Btw, any chance we could get a summary description of tree-chains posted to bitcoin-development? Sure: Introduction BTW for those whose email

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Peter Todd
On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 08:45:00AM -0400, Gavin Andresen wrote: On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org wrote: Bitcoin doesn't scale. There's a lot of issues at hand here, but the most fundemental of them is that to create a block you need to update the state of the

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Mike Hearn
A few months ago I had a conversation with an executive at a Bitcoin company, and I suggested their developers should get involved with the development list. I was told that they are all subscribed but refuse to post. Puzzled, I asked why, maybe the process isn't clear or we didn't talk about what

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Peter Todd
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 For the record, tree chains is designed to be a soft-fork upgrade to bitcoin, at least if we can get the economics to work out. Assuming it does, you would do this by defining bitcoin itself to be the top level chain, and carrying what appear to

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Jeff Garzik
On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 9:49 AM, Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org wrote: For someone with 'Chief Scientist' as their job title, I'm surprised you think so little of hard evidence and so much of idol worshipping. Peter, take this unprofessional, personal crap off-list. Mike's anecdote of hostility

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Alan Reiner
I would echo the need for some kind of moderation. I believe Peter Todd is an extremely intelligent individual, who has a lot to offer the Bitcoin community. He has a firm grasp of a lot of really deep Bitcoin concepts and his *technical* insight is generally positive. Technically. But the

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Peter Todd
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 OK, deal. You guys stop calling my concerns FUD, accusing me of having ulterior motives, etc. and I'll pay the same respect to you. On 25 March 2014 14:13:36 GMT-04:00, slush sl...@centrum.cz wrote: I fully agree, please keep friendly environment

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Ricardo Filipe
2014-03-25 13:49 GMT+00:00 Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org: On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 08:45:00AM -0400, Gavin Andresen wrote: On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org wrote: Bitcoin doesn't scale. There's a lot of issues at hand here, but the most fundemental of them is

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Mark Friedenbach
I'm afraid I'm going to be the jerk that requested more details and then only nitpicks seemingly minor points in your introduction. But its because I need more time to digest the contents of your proposal. Until then: But moving value between chains is inconvenient; right now moving value

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Troy Benjegerdes
Peter, I think you and I both know there is WAAYY to much MONEY to be taken from naive end-users by the companies that employ people who call your concerns FUD. And for everyone else, I want to apologize in advance for anything I might happen to say that might be abrasive, arrogant, angry, or

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Troy Benjegerdes
On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 08:40:40PM +, Ricardo Filipe wrote: 2014-03-25 13:49 GMT+00:00 Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org: On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 08:45:00AM -0400, Gavin Andresen wrote: On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Todd p...@petertodd.org wrote: Bitcoin doesn't scale. There's a

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Tree-chains preliminary summary

2014-03-25 Thread Gregory Maxwell
On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 2:03 PM, Mark Friedenbach m...@monetize.io wrote: More importantly, to your last point there is absolutely no way this scheme can lead to inflation. The worst that could happen is theft of coins willingly put into the pegging pool. But in no way is it possible to