Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-25 Thread Andrea Carpi via Ql-Users
  But this means that 1 byte file will use 32Kb of hard disk space
:-)

I tried qubata v.3.01 on ROM but my old Qubide Hard Disk (created
with qubide rom 2..01) didn't boot
The Hard Disk is a 512Mb drive with 4
partitions of about 120Mb.

If I reinstall 2.01 ROM all run well.

Any
idea?

Andrea Carpi
.

Il 23.07.2017 20:12 Alain HAOUI via Ql-Users ha
scritto: 

> For qubide with driver qubata v3.x the max file size
supported may be 2 gigabytes minus some data structure kilobytes,
provided you have created a suitable big partition with 64 sectors per
block.
> This is the maximum under qdos with 2 words indexes when used
as unsigned.
> Regards,
> Alain
> 
> -Message d'origine-
> De :
"Jan Bredenbeek via Ql-Users" 
> Envoyé : ‎23/‎07/‎2017 17:21
> À :
"ql-us...@q-v-d.com [2]" 
> Objet : Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of
files on QL file-system
> 
> On 23 July 2017 at 15:47, Andrea Carpi via
Ql-Users <
> ql-users@lists.q-v-d.com [4]> wrote:
> 
>> Hello everybody
Trying to transfer large files between Windows 10, QPC2, and
QL-Aurora-SGC-Qubide I have noticed that there are big limitations in
the maximum length of the files. I mean: - On QXL.WIN hard drive in QPC2
I'm not able to generate files longer than 50Mb (End Of file error) - On
the Qubide hard drive the limit is 19Mb (ROM 2.01), but perhaps also
depends on the partition creation choices - On Ram Disk (in QPC2 maximum
RAM 128 Mb) I did not find any limits unless the size of the RAM - I did
not find limits on DOS devices from QPC2 except those of the file system
in use on Windows (NTFS) Specifically for QXL.WIN and QUBIDE do anyone
know the exact length limits and why?
> 
> The QDOS file system stores
the file position in the channel definition
> block as two 16-bit words
- one for the block number and one for the byte
> position within one
block. So, when using 512-byte blocks, the maximum file
> length will be
65535*512 bytes or just under 32MB (or 16MB when using
> signed
arithmetic). When using 2K byte blocks, the limit will be 128 or
> 64MB
respectively.
> 
> I know mdv and flp use 512-byte block size and ED flp
have 2K byte sectors
> but I'm not sure if the latter also uses 2K
blocks. The same goes for
> (virtual) win drives - sectors are usually
grouped to keep the map within
> limits but I don't know off-hand if
that also affects the block size (it
> might as well be 512 bytes,
depending on the driver).
> 
> This use of word-sized block numbers
within QDOS is an unfortunate design
> flaw - as is the standard
FS.MDINF trap which returns word-sized sector
> counts - but could TT
back in 1984 foresee that within five years there
> would be a storage
medium for the QL that surpassed the 32MB limit? In the
> PC world there
are multiple examples of this - remember the 32MB partition
> size limit
in DOS 3.3, then the 528MB limit on CHS-addressed hard disks,
> and the
initial 128GB limit on LBA which was supposed to 'fix' CHS.
> 
> Storage
capacity has grown so much that any 'X MB ought to be enough for
>
everybody' design decision has proven wrong eventually...
> 
> -- *Jan
Bredenbeek* | Hilversum, NL | j...@bredenbeek.net [5]
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Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-25 Thread Andrea Carpi via Ql-Users
  Thak You Wolf

I tried to create a zip file 70Mb long on a 200Mb
QXL.WIN (with QPC2 + ACP + INFOZIP) and I obtained an "end of file"
error when the length was abou 50Mb.
Do you know why?

If I try this on
ramdisk the zip file is created normally.
If I copy this file from
ramdisk to the 200Mb QXL.WIN I obtain "end of file" error.
Could it be
an INFOZIP bug?

Andrea

Il 23.07.2017 17:23 Wolfgang Lenerz via
Ql-Users ha scritto: 

> Hi,
> 
> there are limits to the QLWA
(i.e.qxl.win) file system, but they 
> shouldn't be so small.
> 
>
Basically, a file is limited to the size of the "disk" (it obviously 
>
can't be bigger than that) minus some overhead (for the FAT, the root 
>
secor and the rot directory). The QLWA system is a FAT type system. each

> entry in the FAT (called "map" in SMSQE parlance) is a word (2 bytes)

> long, so you can't reference more than 65536 clusters (or "allocation

> units"). A file could occupy all of these clusters (minus the
overhead).
> 
> I just created a 400 MB QXL.win disk and copied a 200 MB
file onto it. 
> No problem with file size there, it's just pretty slow
under SMSQmulator.
> 
> Qubide isn't that much different, except that
each entry in the FAT 
> takes a long word (4 bytes).
> 
> HTH
> 
>
Wolfgang
> 
>> Trying to transfer large files between Windows 10, QPC2,
and QL-Aurora-SGC-Qubide I have noticed that there are big limitations
in the maximum length of the files. I mean: - On QXL.WIN hard drive in
QPC2 I'm not able to generate files longer than 50Mb (End Of file error)
- On the Qubide hard drive the limit is 19Mb (ROM 2.01), but perhaps
also depends on the partition creation choices - On Ram Disk (in QPC2
maximum RAM 128 Mb) I did not find any limits unless the size of the RAM
- I did not find limits on DOS devices from QPC2 except those of the
file system in use on Windows (NTFS) Specifically for QXL.WIN and QUBIDE
do anyone know the exact length limits and why? Thank you Andrea Carpi
Con Mobile Open 7 GB a 9 euro/4 sett navighi veloce con 7 GB di Internet
e hai 200 minuti ed SMS a 15 cent. Passa a Tiscali Mobile!
http://tisca.li/Open7GB0617 [1]
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>

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List
  


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Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-25 Thread Andrea Carpi via Ql-Users
  Thank You Jan

All clear!

So I need to verify my Qubide Hard Disk
with Partitio.exe
I don't remember with what block length I formatted
that partition

Andrea

Il 23.07.2017 17:21 Jan Bredenbeek via Ql-Users
ha scritto: 

> The QDOS file system stores the file position in the
channel definition
> block as two 16-bit words - one for the block
number and one for the byte
> position within one block. So, when using
512-byte blocks, the maximum file
> length will be 65535*512 bytes or
just under 32MB (or 16MB when using
> signed arithmetic). When using 2K
byte blocks, the limit will be 128 or
> 64MB respectively.
> 
> I know
mdv and flp use 512-byte block size and ED flp have 2K byte sectors
>
but I'm not sure if the latter also uses 2K blocks. The same goes for
>
(virtual) win drives - sectors are usually grouped to keep the map
within
> limits but I don't know off-hand if that also affects the block
size (it
> might as well be 512 bytes, depending on the driver).
> 
>
This use of word-sized block numbers within QDOS is an unfortunate
design
> flaw - as is the standard FS.MDINF trap which returns
word-sized sector
> counts - but could TT back in 1984 foresee that
within five years there
> would be a storage medium for the QL that
surpassed the 32MB limit? In the
> PC world there are multiple examples
of this - remember the 32MB partition
> size limit in DOS 3.3, then the
528MB limit on CHS-addressed hard disks,
> and the initial 128GB limit
on LBA which was supposed to 'fix' CHS.
> 
> Storage capacity has grown
so much that any 'X MB ought to be enough for
> everybody' design
decision has proven wrong eventually...
> 
> -- *Jan Bredenbeek* |
Hilversum, NL | j...@bredenbeek.net [1]
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Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-23 Thread Alain HAOUI via Ql-Users
For qubide with driver qubata v3.x the max file size supported may be 2 
gigabytes minus some data structure kilobytes, provided you have created a 
suitable big partition with 64 sectors per block.
This is the maximum under qdos with 2 words indexes when used as unsigned.
Regards,
Alain

-Message d'origine-
De : "Jan Bredenbeek via Ql-Users" <ql-users@lists.q-v-d.com>
Envoyé : ‎23/‎07/‎2017 17:21
À : "ql-us...@q-v-d.com" <ql-us...@q-v-d.com>
Objet : Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

On 23 July 2017 at 15:47, Andrea Carpi via Ql-Users <
ql-users@lists.q-v-d.com> wrote:

>   Hello everybody
>
> Trying to transfer large files between Windows 10,
> QPC2, and QL-Aurora-SGC-Qubide I have noticed that there are big
> limitations in the maximum length of the files.
>
> I mean:
> - On QXL.WIN
> hard drive in QPC2 I'm not able to generate files longer than 50Mb (End
> Of file error)
> - On the Qubide hard drive the limit is 19Mb (ROM 2.01),
> but perhaps also depends on the partition creation choices
>
> - On Ram
> Disk (in QPC2 maximum RAM 128 Mb) I did not find any limits unless the
> size of the RAM
> - I did not find limits on DOS devices from QPC2 except
> those of the file system in use on Windows (NTFS)
>
> Specifically for
> QXL.WIN and QUBIDE do anyone know the exact length limits and
> why?
>

The QDOS file system stores the file position in the channel definition
block as two 16-bit words - one for the block number and one for the byte
position within one block. So, when using 512-byte blocks, the maximum file
length will be 65535*512 bytes or just under 32MB (or 16MB when using
signed arithmetic). When using 2K byte blocks, the limit will be 128 or
64MB respectively.

I know mdv and flp use 512-byte block size and ED flp have 2K byte sectors
but I'm not sure if the latter also uses 2K blocks. The same goes for
(virtual) win drives - sectors are usually grouped to keep the map within
limits but I don't know off-hand if that also affects the block size (it
might as well be 512 bytes, depending on the driver).

This use of word-sized block numbers within QDOS is an unfortunate design
flaw - as is the standard FS.MDINF trap which returns word-sized sector
counts - but could TT back in 1984 foresee that within five years there
would be a storage medium for the QL that surpassed the 32MB limit? In the
PC world there are multiple examples of this - remember the 32MB partition
size limit in DOS 3.3, then the 528MB limit on CHS-addressed hard disks,
and the initial 128GB limit on LBA which was supposed to 'fix' CHS.

Storage capacity has grown so much that any 'X MB ought to be enough for
everybody' design decision has proven wrong eventually...

-- 
*Jan Bredenbeek* | Hilversum, NL | j...@bredenbeek.net
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Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-23 Thread Wolfgang Lenerz via Ql-Users

Hi,

there are limits to the QLWA (i.e.qxl.win) file system, but they 
shouldn't be so small.


Basically, a file is limited to the size of the "disk" (it obviously 
can't be bigger than that) minus some overhead (for the FAT, the root 
secor and the rot directory). The QLWA system is a FAT type system. each 
entry in the FAT (called "map" in SMSQE parlance) is a word (2 bytes) 
long, so you can't reference more than 65536 clusters (or "allocation 
units"). A file could occupy all of these clusters (minus the overhead).


I just created a 400 MB QXL.win disk and copied a 200 MB file onto it. 
No problem with file size there, it's just pretty slow under SMSQmulator.


Qubide isn't that much different, except that each entry in the FAT 
takes a long word (4 bytes).



HTH

Wolfgang




Trying to transfer large files between Windows 10,
QPC2, and QL-Aurora-SGC-Qubide I have noticed that there are big
limitations in the maximum length of the files.

I mean:
- On QXL.WIN
hard drive in QPC2 I'm not able to generate files longer than 50Mb (End
Of file error)
- On the Qubide hard drive the limit is 19Mb (ROM 2.01),
but perhaps also depends on the partition creation choices

- On Ram
Disk (in QPC2 maximum RAM 128 Mb) I did not find any limits unless the
size of the RAM
- I did not find limits on DOS devices from QPC2 except
those of the file system in use on Windows (NTFS)

Specifically for
QXL.WIN and QUBIDE do anyone know the exact length limits and
why?

Thank you

Andrea Carpi


Con Mobile Open 7 GB a 9 euro/4 sett navighi veloce con 7 GB di Internet e hai 
200 minuti ed SMS a 15 cent. Passa a Tiscali Mobile! http://tisca.li/Open7GB0617

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Re: [Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-23 Thread Jan Bredenbeek via Ql-Users
On 23 July 2017 at 15:47, Andrea Carpi via Ql-Users <
ql-users@lists.q-v-d.com> wrote:

>   Hello everybody
>
> Trying to transfer large files between Windows 10,
> QPC2, and QL-Aurora-SGC-Qubide I have noticed that there are big
> limitations in the maximum length of the files.
>
> I mean:
> - On QXL.WIN
> hard drive in QPC2 I'm not able to generate files longer than 50Mb (End
> Of file error)
> - On the Qubide hard drive the limit is 19Mb (ROM 2.01),
> but perhaps also depends on the partition creation choices
>
> - On Ram
> Disk (in QPC2 maximum RAM 128 Mb) I did not find any limits unless the
> size of the RAM
> - I did not find limits on DOS devices from QPC2 except
> those of the file system in use on Windows (NTFS)
>
> Specifically for
> QXL.WIN and QUBIDE do anyone know the exact length limits and
> why?
>

The QDOS file system stores the file position in the channel definition
block as two 16-bit words - one for the block number and one for the byte
position within one block. So, when using 512-byte blocks, the maximum file
length will be 65535*512 bytes or just under 32MB (or 16MB when using
signed arithmetic). When using 2K byte blocks, the limit will be 128 or
64MB respectively.

I know mdv and flp use 512-byte block size and ED flp have 2K byte sectors
but I'm not sure if the latter also uses 2K blocks. The same goes for
(virtual) win drives - sectors are usually grouped to keep the map within
limits but I don't know off-hand if that also affects the block size (it
might as well be 512 bytes, depending on the driver).

This use of word-sized block numbers within QDOS is an unfortunate design
flaw - as is the standard FS.MDINF trap which returns word-sized sector
counts - but could TT back in 1984 foresee that within five years there
would be a storage medium for the QL that surpassed the 32MB limit? In the
PC world there are multiple examples of this - remember the 32MB partition
size limit in DOS 3.3, then the 528MB limit on CHS-addressed hard disks,
and the initial 128GB limit on LBA which was supposed to 'fix' CHS.

Storage capacity has grown so much that any 'X MB ought to be enough for
everybody' design decision has proven wrong eventually...

-- 
*Jan Bredenbeek* | Hilversum, NL | j...@bredenbeek.net
___
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[Ql-Users] Maximum length of files on QL file-system

2017-07-23 Thread Andrea Carpi via Ql-Users
  Hello everybody

Trying to transfer large files between Windows 10,
QPC2, and QL-Aurora-SGC-Qubide I have noticed that there are big
limitations in the maximum length of the files.

I mean:
- On QXL.WIN
hard drive in QPC2 I'm not able to generate files longer than 50Mb (End
Of file error)
- On the Qubide hard drive the limit is 19Mb (ROM 2.01),
but perhaps also depends on the partition creation choices

- On Ram
Disk (in QPC2 maximum RAM 128 Mb) I did not find any limits unless the
size of the RAM
- I did not find limits on DOS devices from QPC2 except
those of the file system in use on Windows (NTFS)

Specifically for
QXL.WIN and QUBIDE do anyone know the exact length limits and
why?

Thank you

Andrea Carpi  


Con Mobile Open 7 GB a 9 euro/4 sett navighi veloce con 7 GB di Internet e hai 
200 minuti ed SMS a 15 cent. Passa a Tiscali Mobile! http://tisca.li/Open7GB0617

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