It¹s a concern because I always look ahead to the ramifications of present actions.
It¹s a concern because I have been involved with community associations who tried to steer this neighborhood¹s development and done lot¹s of hard work to make this community better before you have. My concern is that it would be no longer a committee or oversight AdHoc committee that would be able to check that all are included. Cyber-space is MUCH too large and if UC Neighbors has upenn.edu domain, there is NO way longtime battle-scarred residents could compete against the Penn name, credibility, money etc. True open community discourse pro or con as to the development of this community will be squelched. Today? No. But the door has opened. The, ³Oh, just let us have a civilized discussion amongst neighbors.² is a straw man that will break the camel¹s back.² If you don¹t agree, fine. Just mark my words. I will not forget what objections I raised and for what reason and when. I know a power play when I see it. THIS time it¹s something different that cannot be sorted out or discussed by usual means and could much more damaging. Put the listserv on Google, Yahoo MySpace as Dave Axler told me. Post all you will and let people find you. On 7/30/07 1:52 PM, "Mike V." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Why is that a "concern", Wilma? Why are you invested in people not making an > incorrect, easily-correctible assumption? > > - Mike V. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> On Behalf Of Wilma de Soto >> Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 12:58 PM >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; UnivCity listserv >> Subject: Re: JOIN UC NEIGHBORS FOR CIVILIZED CONVERSATION Re: [UC] Since the >> real reason for the new list is... >> >> No one faults people starting a new listserv forum, at least I don¹t. Move >> away as you will. Lke Dave said they could have used Google, Yahoo, >> MySpace, whatever. But they didn¹t. >> >> My concern is when people see the upenn.edu domain, they will naturally >> assume the UC Neighbors Listserv is associated with Penn (since they are >> using Penn¹s domain. This would lead people to believe that the new >> listserv is more legitimate and more credible that the UC Listserv. I also >> feel it will add to further vilification of participants on this listserv. >> >> Your post title certainly indicates to me that has already begun, along with >> accusations of conspiracy theories etc. >> >> Those who deny that is the case especially when handbills are passed to >> recruit new people, are not being entirely honest with themselves. Also, >> people who wanted to form the new listserv are not being entirely honest by >> saying they have only been the victim of vituperation on list and never the >> perpetrator. >> >> >> On 7/30/07 12:28 PM, "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >>> >>> In a message dated 7/30/07 11:45:03 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >>> ......Kyle didn't start the UCNeighbor list because he was being >>> childish or selfish and walking away with his bat and ball. He started it >>> because the communication on this listserv is becoming petty, myopic and >>> insulting. It's also becoming a crowded room (virtually speaking) with some >>> loud voices trying to drown out the once speaking in a normal tone. Some >>> people do act like they own this list and like to think that they can >>> dictate and frame the conversation and debates that occur here. Many people >>> have started doing the serial deleting of [UC]-labelled emails, because >>> it's become less relevant and helpful to the average UC resident. I don't >>> know about you, but this puts people a hair-trigger away from leaving the >>> listserv and the community discussion that occurs here. No one is excluded >>> or protected on Kyle's new listserv either. You can still take the >>> conversation there, if you want to, and your bat and ball. >>> >>> This weekend, the heavy-handed people on the purple list found out that >>> their readers now have the option to move away, and clearly, they don't >>> want that to happen. So - did they offer to moderate their language and >>> help develop a set of guidelines? No, they became even more heavy-handed! >>> Several attacked Bruce Anderson for suggesting guidelines. Some even >>> tried to blame Jon Herrmann, who wrote that he had not read the last 13,000 >>> emails posted on the purple list in the last 15 months - now, that shows how >>> involved HE is, doesn't it? Some renewed conspiracy theories, one >>> generated new spoof posts, and as usual, a small but noisy group attacked >>> the person who saw a need to do something and actually DID it. >>> >>> But, why should we be stuck with a dysfunctional list which will not >>> change? >>> >>> I came in for criticism for saying it would be heaven to be on a list >>> without one particularly voluminous ranter who has focused on me, sometimes >>> alarmingly. Why would I want to be on a list with member who sends out >>> fantasy emails about what he wants to have happen to me in Clark Park? >>> Why would I recommend that the buyers and sellers I work with join a >>> listserv where they'd read that kind of stuff with my name in it, where a >>> neighborhood fanatic would single me out for ridicule though I've never >>> even met the man? Is it any surprise I think it will be "heaven" to be on >>> a list where that sort of email isn't likely to be tolerated? >>> >>> Kyle CAN ban that individual on the new list, but he won't, if the >>> individual is civil to his fellow list members. Anyone can sign up, and >>> the archives are public, so even non members can read what's written. >>> There's no conspiracy and lots of transparency. >>> >>> I'm afraid that "spoof" addresses have been posted more often than the >>> actual one for Kyle's new list, so I'll include it again here to counteract >>> the usual poster of misinformation. >>> >>> http://lists.asc.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/ucneighbors >>> >>> <http://lists.asc.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/ucneighbors> - Melani Lamond >>> >>> >>> ************************************** >>> Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at >>> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour >> >
