Just one question Hari when did your colleague know that his contract was being renewed? Was he informed a few hours in advance or did he know atleast a week earlier that his contract was being renewed. Kanchan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hari Raghavan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 09:13 Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities...
> Hi List, > > Firstly folks I am sorry to reply on this topic so late but I am running a > couple of weeks late in checking my personal mails. I felt it imperative > to give a perspective on this discussion. > > This concept of contract employees is fast gaining ground across corporate > India and has been pioneered by the American MNCs. I have worked in two > such > large MNCs General Electric and now IBM. Contract employment is usually > given to non post graduates and for jobs where the skill requirement is > relatively low. As contract employees do not figure in the head count, > this > is one way to keep the figures low and as they do not get some of the > benefits of regular employees, it aalso keeps employee costs down. The > best > part for these corporations is that you do not have to devise a growth > path > or worry about the employees career development if they are on contract. > > Now to give you the other side of the story - I have had several contract > employees as well as regular staff report in to me and it is my experience > that contract employees usually work harder and are more dedicated than > regular staff who usually take their job for granted. As they do the real > "work", our department would come to a complete standstill if they were > absent. I can't say the same about my regular employees / managerial > staff. > And it used to hurt when these same hard working employees could not join > us > for our office parties or offsites which were exclusively for regular > employees. > > While I do understand the agony of not being able to grow to one's > potential, I believe it is a product of the way the contract system works > more than a result of discrimination. I share my cubicle in IBM with a guy > from logistics who works extremely hard from 10 am to 9pm and works on > saturdays too. This guy was on contract from 2001 till last year when he > got > regularised, i.e. 6 years to get on the company rolls despite sterling > efforts. > > Finally, I believe that as more and more of us get employed in this > country, > any discriminatory attitudes will change. Till such a time, let's keep OUR > attitude positive and keep at it. > > Warm regards, > Hari > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Harish > Kotian > Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 8:38 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... > > > Hi Folks > > Employment opportunities for the PWD in the IT enabled services is a > rescent > phenomena. > > It takes some time for the industry to feel comfortable. Those now in > this > space are the ambassadors for future growth in this area. As it often > happens, the genie pigs have to take a larger share of traumma. > > When we view in a larger canvass, every growth phase starts with expansion > and later it moves towards consolidation. Presently we are in the nascent > stage. > > The consolidation stage will take place when we come to a critical mass. > > I can surely empathise with those effected who would consider this all > as > pep talk. > > These words certainly leads to no solution but would be calling to seek > more > patience which I can understand is fast running out. > > Towards reaching some solution, I can suggest we have some dialogue like a > seminar on employment of the PWD, we call most of the employers who are > indulging in some what discriminatory practices and confront them with a > cross section of our folks who would put the realities in the right > perspective. > > I don't know how effective this would turn up, but a suggestion to > consider. > > Harish. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Subramani L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 12:11 PM > Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... > > >> Dear Sudhir: >> >> Your second suggestion (i.e.) the blog to counter politically correct >> reports, is a good one. However, to what extent the disabled can look up >> to government for employment is unknown. >> >> For a start, one account in Karnataka says around 380 jobs in Karnataka >> alone (reserved for the disabled) are not filled from 1971. I have also >> learnt recently that the disability welfare department in the state has >> no idea as to how many vacancies are there in all the state government >> department for persons with disability. Above all, the special >> employment agencies are simply sleeping over the registrations and don't >> inform the PWD's registered with them about the vacancies. So, how do >> you think we can move these immovable and even dead elephants? >> >> Subramani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sudhir R >> (NeSTIT) >> Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 11:49 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >> >> *********************** >> No virus was detected in the attachment no filename >> >> Your mail has been scanned by InterScan. >> ***********-*********** >> >> >> Dear Subramony, >> >> Yes, the attempt should be to find a solution and methinks highlighting >> this invisible problem is itself part of the solution. The youngsters >> who have read these exchanges are at least now aware that the corporate >> sector adopts two employment models, contractual and regular and often >> discriminates against the disabled, even while proclaiming from >> roof-tops about their noble missions. This awareness itself should >> equip them to scrutinise the job offers that are handed to them, read >> between the lines and possibly not to close their minds against the >> government sector jobs altogether. >> >> Legally, there may be little that we can do, without jeopardising the >> future of our own folks. May be, we can do more discreet investigations >> to determine the extent of rot and perhaps start a blog to counter the >> politically correct reports coming forth in the mainstream media. >> >> More suggestions are welcome from the mature and experienced members. >> Remember, this is a classic case of discrimination as was the raw >> treatment meted out to some of our members by certain private airlines, >> banking institutions etc, but, the sound and fury of the debates at such >> instances seem to be missing this time because the sufferers are silent >> about it. >> >> Rgds >> >> RS >> M: 98 472 76 126 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Subramani L >> Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 11:24 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >> >> >> In effect, what you are trying to say is while we can say ok to >> contracts, we can't say yes to deferred promotions and lack of >> recognition of performance and so on. But how do we confront this? As >> Rajesh had said we can't legally prove discrimination of this sort, as >> we have sighned up to the contract (which means we are agreeing to the >> terms). Also, how do we distinguish those employers who are creating the >> impression that they have an inclusive policy, while actually >> discriminating in rewarding performances, from those who are genuinely >> inclusive? The purpose of this should be tyo find solutions, rather than >> just exchanging ideas. >> >> Subramani >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sudhir R >> (NeSTIT) >> Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 9:23 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >> >> *********************** >> No virus was detected in the attachment no filename >> >> Your mail has been scanned by InterScan. >> ***********-*********** >> >> >> Dear Harish, >> >> I am not disputing the contract employment system, the retrenchment >> possibility even while in regular employment, the attraction of the IT >> sector or the hard bargain a good professional can drive with a >> prospective employer. >> >> I am merely bothered by the singular way IT majors seem to apply this >> practice to their disabled employees. Parimala's is not an isolated >> case, believe me. Other sufferers are also there on our group and I am >> sure, lots of persons with other disabilities are also discriminated >> against similarly. >> >> In fact, I know of one instance where a high profile CEO of a IT company >> waxed eloquent about opening the doors of his company to the visually >> challenged a few years back, hired a few trainees while he was holding >> an important position in Nasscom and quietly packed them off after he >> faded from the limelight. I have no complaints against him if the >> contract termination was due to the non-performance of the resources. >> But, knowing the corporate penchant for hogging media, it is very >> possible that the entire episode was an orchestrated one, the poor >> visually challenged resources being the sacrificial goats in the >> process. >> >> What amazes me is how the very companies that practise this >> discrimination towards the disabled, still hog the limelight in the >> media as equal opportunity employers of PWDs. Their advertising budget >> ensures that the mainstream media toes their line without any trace of >> the investigative journalism or sting operations that seem to be >> reserved only for politicians and bureaucrats. Wish I had got this >> information on the day rediff.com carried the article on IT companies >> opening their doors to the visually challenged which I had naively and >> enthusiastically posted in AI a few weeks back. I could have at least >> written a few nasty comments on the true state of affairs and the >> readers might have got a more balanced view of the issue. (smile) >> >> Rgds >> >> RS >> M: 98 472 76 126 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Harish >> Kotian >> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 9:48 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >> >> >> Hi Sudhir >> >> Even in public sectors, they are going for contract jobs. Even if one >> gets a >> regular employent, anyone can be easily retrenched. >> >> All said and done, for a fresher private sector is a great learning >> place. >> >> Good hands are in much demand in the IT space and one can leveridge it >> in a >> period of time to ones advantage. >> >> Harish. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Sudhir R (NeSTIT)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 9:10 AM >> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >> >> >>> Dear Harish bhai, >>> >>> I fully agree with you that contract employment could act as the thin >> edge >>> of the wedge to induce companies to consider employing the differently >> >>> abled employees. And, uncertainties do bring out the best from us >> too. >>> >>> But, the fact remains that the best trapeze artists and movie stuntmen >> >>> perform with a safety net to catch them should anything go wrong. >> (smile) >>> I am afraid I can't effectively articulate the gnawing fears and >>> trepidations of a disabled resource working in a IT company who gets >> his >>> contract renewed often only on the last day and perhaps only for a >> further >>> period of six months. I was hoping some of these silent sufferers to >>> speak out, but, obviously they might be feeling embarrassed or >> insecure >>> and I fully empathise with their unenviable situation. >>> >>> Being a banking professional, you will agree with me that life >> requires >>> one to plan ahead for security of our own selves and that of our >> family, >>> like buying a home, making investments for retirement etc. In the >> absence >>> of a working social security mechanism in India, the best bet for a >>> disabled person is still a steady job which guarantees a steady stream >> of >>> predictable revenues. From this point of view, contract employment, >>> highly favoured by the hard core professionals who can dictate their >>> terms, is not the best of news for our young friends. >>> >>> This is what I wanted to highlight through my mail, since I know (and >> I >>> myself have been recommending) many bright youngsters have been >> looking >>> away from the staid government sector job markets to these glamourous >>> sunrise sectors. All that glitters, as is often in real life, is not >>> obviously gold. (smile) >>> >>> Rgds >>> >>> RS >>> M: 098 472 76 126 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Harish >>> Kotian >>> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 7:02 AM >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >>> >>> >>> Hi Sudhir >>> >>> You have raised a very interesting topic for introspection. >>> >>> In my personal view, contract work is a sort of blessing in disguise. >>> >>> 1 The employers are apprehensive about the capabilities of the blind. >> This >>> gives us a window to make an entry and gives us an opportunity to >> prove >>> ourselves. >>> >>> 2 Due to the uncertainties involved it forces one to get the best out >> of >>> us. >>> >>> However, uncertainty is not desirable in a long run to maintain >> healthy >>> relationship. >>> >>> This can be nicely put to the folks in the HR dept who have >> specialists >>> out >>> there to understand it better. >>> >>> Intervention of NGO's or help from HR consultuncy firms can also help >> in >>> getting the message across. >>> >>> Once having gained experience and having sharpened skill sets one is >> in a >>> better position to find jobs elsewhere. Now, one is in a better >> position >>> to >>> clinch a deal to ones terms. >>> >>> I personally feel it is better to grow in an organisation than keep >>> changing >>> jobs frequently. >>> >>> It helps mutually. >>> Harish. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Sudhir R (NeSTIT)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 9:40 AM >>> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >>> >>> >>>> Dear Subramony, >>>> >>>> I can understand hard core professionals opting for contract-based >>>> employment that allows them to be loose-coupled to the employer. >> But, >>>> this is a voluntary decision and most often than not, the terms of >> the >>>> contract are thrashed out after mutual discussions. >>>> >>>> The cases I referred to in my original mail pertains to trainees, not >>>> professionals. I am quite sure they would prefer regular jobs, if >> given >>>> a >>>> choice, since their professional skill-sets are not well-developed. >> And, >>>> what are thrust upon these hapless youngsters are unilateral >> contracts, >>>> not ones discussed thread-bare. >>>> >>>> And, of course, the matter of discrimination comes up when just the >>>> disabled candidates have to put up with such 'modern' practices. >> Those >>>> able-bodied who join along with them or after them are taken on >> rolls. >>>> Now, do you smell something fishy ? >>>> >>>> Rgds >>>> >>>> RS >>>> M: 98 472 76 126 >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Subramani >> L >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 9:36 AM >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Subject: Re: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >>>> >>>> >>>> Dear Sudhir: >>>> >>>> I am not too conversant with the legalese of contract employment, but >> it >>>> is certainly becoming the trend. Why IT, even the media industry is >> fast >>>> adapting these practices. And, several journalists (both in print and >>>> broadcast), who are able bodied, prefer contract not only because >> they >>>> are paid higher, but also because it is much easier to leave when >> they >>>> no longer inclined to work. >>>> >>>> As far as my knowledge goes, contract employment isn't exclusively >>>> offered to the blind or disabled. On the contrary, even the so-called >>>> able-bodied persons have to accede to demands of employers that they >>>> will be taken as contract employees. Also, contracts in the >> traditional >>>> sense is different from what we are referring here as contracts. Why >>>> contracts, I know IT employees (who are able-bodied) who are asked to >>>> sign a bond that stops them from leaving the company for two or three >>>> years. In my opinion, that is more discriminatory than contracts. >>>> >>>> Let's not forget that we live in a knowledge economy, where >>>> opportunities are increasing with corresponding risks. So, in this >>>> environment, how far we can expect traditional employment terms to be >>>> applied remains a doubt. Perhaps, Rajesh or Kanchan can answer this >> from >>>> a legal perspective. >>>> >>>> Subramani >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sudhir R >>>> (NeSTIT) >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 9:13 AM >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Subject: [AI] IT sector employment - stark realities... >>>> >>>> *********************** >>>> No virus was detected in the attachment no filename >>>> >>>> Your mail has been scanned by InterScan. >>>> ***********-*********** >>>> >>>> >>>> Dear friends, >>>> >>>> We have all been enthused in recent months by the continuous stream >> of >>>> 'heart-warming' news reports from the booming IT and ITES sectors of >>>> India opening their doors to the visually challenged. But, closer >>>> observation of the facts on the ground reveal certain trends that are >>>> disquieting and disillusioning and though not politically correct, I >>>> thought I must bring these to the kind attention of Access Indians. >>>> >>>> a) It seems many of those who have been recruited have been taken in >> as >>>> contract employees and remain so for years together. The professed >>>> excuse bandied by the companies is that they want to keep the actual >>>> employee count low. This excuse would have held water had not the >>>> companies gladly confirmed the non-disabled staff members who were >>>> recruited along with or much later than their disabled counterparts. >> I >>>> can understand a company extending an employee's probation if he does >>>> not measure up, but, extending contracts umpteen number of times seem >> to >>>> take on sinister tones. >>>> >>>> b) Simultaneously, I think these unfortunate disabled candidates also >>>> suffer discriminatory treatment vis-a-vis their non-disabled peers >> in >>>> terms of compensation and benefit, seniority etc due to the long >> years >>>> they spend as contract employees. >>>> >>>> c) It may be fashionable to explain this phenomenon as a modern >> trend >>>> in employment thanks to globalisation, but, when it applies only to >> one >>>> segment of (disadvantaged) employees, I prefer to call it high-handed >>>> discrimination. India does not have a social security mechanism in >>>> place and the best bet for any disabled resource is still the >> security >>>> of a regular job. Unfortunately, the current practice seems to be >>>> denying this precise safety net to the disabled. >>>> >>>> I am not sure how many of Access Indians working in the IT / ITES >> sector >>>> are currently suffering this discrimination silently, hoping to be >>>> confirmed in the years to come. But, anecdotal evidence has shown me >>>> that many of the so-called 'equal opportunity employers' who hog >> media >>>> limelight with their 'diversity enrichment' programmes are major >>>> culprits of this shameful practice. May be, a few of the silent >>>> sufferers should speak out for the sake of other starry-eyed >> youngsters >>>> who have been building castles in thin air after reading all these >> media >>>> reports. >>>> >>>> Simultaneously, can legal eagles like Kanchan and Rajesh educate us >>>> about the current Indian laws applicable to the rights of contract >>>> employees ? I am sure it is mandatory for a company to confirm an >>>> employee after a particular period of being a contract employee. How >>>> does one go about enforcing such laws and how risky would such a >>>> procedure be ? >>>> >>>> And, Subramony, can you smell a journalistic scoop in this issue ? >>>> >>>> >>>> I have been an avid votary of the IT and ITES sector as possible >>>> sources of fullfilling and well-paying careers for the visually >>>> challenged and have even been discouraging the local youngsters from >>>> looking at the unglamourous Government sector, but, I should admit >> this >>>> revelation has forced me to revise my recommendations. In fact, I >> have >>>> started wondering whether this phenomenon is restricted merely to the >> IT >>>> / ITES sector or a characteristic of the entire private sector. I >> know >>>> of at least one case in Kerala where a manufacturing company has been >>>> employing a visually challenged youngster for almost 9 years as a >>>> contract employee at half the salary he would have been entitled for >> in >>>> regular service. >>>> >>>> Please share your individual views, suggestions and experiences in >> this >>>> matter. Skeletons have remained in the corporate cupboards for too >>>> long, methinks... >>>> >>>> Regards >>>> >>>> R Sudhir >>>> M: 098 472 76 126 >>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>> >>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>> please visit the list home page at >>>> >>>> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >>>> n >>>> >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>> >>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>> please visit the list home page at >>>> >>>> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>> >>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>> please visit the list home page at >>>> >>>> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> To unsubscribe send a message to >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>> >>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>> please visit the list home page at >>> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >>> >>> To unsubscribe send a message to >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>> >>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>> please visit the list home page at >>> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >>> >> >> >> >> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> with the subject unsubscribe. >> >> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >> please visit the list home page at >> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >> >> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> with the subject unsubscribe. >> >> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >> please visit the list home page at >> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >> >> >> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> with the subject unsubscribe. >> >> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >> please visit the list home page at >> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >> >> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> with the subject unsubscribe. >> >> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >> please visit the list home page at >> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.i >> n >> >> >> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> with the subject unsubscribe. >> >> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >> please visit the list home page at >> >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >> > > > > To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with > the subject unsubscribe. > > To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, > please > visit the list home page at > http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://in.messenger.yahoo.com > > > To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with the subject unsubscribe. > > To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, > please visit the list home page at > http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in > To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the subject unsubscribe. 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