Which, is exactly why I'm back in the 'talk' mode with NetPro, despite the fact that I can't get management to even look at the product. MOM is good enough in their opinion, but MOM hasn't helped us solve one Replication issue, or an e-mail issue (well, OK - does a great job of telling me when a store is off line....).
We have a multi-domain, multi-forest, multi-org environment, which means I can't afford to have anything but tools that are going to be exacting in pinpointing and resolving issues - because in our environment, like most others these days, e-mail is mission critical. And because e-mail relies heavily upon the directory, it has to be right - always. And, when it's not - I need to know why - fast. Rick Kingslan MCSE, MCSA, MCT Microsoft MVP - Active Directory Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Myrick, Todd (NIH/CIT) Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 8:28 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] OT: NetIQ or MOM If you have a large AD deployment, with multiple AD Domains, you will probably want to add NETPRO Directory Analyzer and DNS Analyzer to your monitoring solution. Personally when it comes to my strategy with regard to Monitoring and Backup I have successfully been encouraging my AD Operations to have their own tools that work with the centralized monitoring and backup operations. This layered approach for Backup has served me quite well for operational continuity, because Backups always get pooched centrally no matter what they do. And you never know it till you need it. In regards to monitoring, Historically MOM and AppManager have been okay at looking at a single domain or a group of servers in a given domain, but when it comes to looking at all the domains, DC/GC, and overall health of the AD, (Replication, FRS, Sites, GC, Connectivity) you will probably need the add-in tools for MOM that NETPRO provides. Just my 2 cents. Todd -----Original Message----- From: Glenn Corbett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:43 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] OT: NetIQ or MOM Agrred Marcus, I am expecting BIG things from MOM 2004, otherwise I might start looking elsewhere (or have to get some additional minions to take some load off me so I can spend more time looking after MOM). Dont forget, that the MOM DTS package jobs were an afterthought as well, the ootb (out of the box) install didnt have such functionality I would love for the MOM agent/scripting functionality to be accessible outside of MOM as well. We have a bunch of scripts that do various things on server (like scheduled admin pwd resets), and would like for them to be able to push events into MOM. Currently it requires a bit of a hack to get the script to put an event in the event log, then have a MOM rule to pick it up. Not ideal, but workable in the current version. Customised rulesets for servers within a MOM environment is its biggest annoyance for me atm, and is something that REALLY needs to get fixed RSN. currently (without LOTS of custom cumputer groups) I have to set alerts to a lower threshold just to catch one server I'm interested in, and then just ignore the alerts from the servers I'm not worried about. Makes for lots of alerts and difficult for me to pass on the alerts to 2nd level support. G. On Sat, 2003-10-11 at 09:36, Marcus Oh wrote: > Done the same, going through a MOM deployment now... > > I agree wholeheartedly on most points made. AppManager is BY FAR > easier to navigate and use. I do find that MOM delivers better bang > for the buck in terms of latent knowledge in product rule sets. > Setting up AppManager to pick up all those events, counters, etc... > would take quite a long time. > > Make sure you look at the support model as well, since NetIQ generally > uses a year-long contract, use as many calls as you want... and MOM is > PSS calls based. > > Reporting in both products suck and neither are built for long-term > reporting. As someone alluded to earlier, reporting for AppManager > (long-term) was an afterthought. They created another product which > the same agent can communicate with to store the same data point in > two different locations... the idea being to groom your AppManager > database often to keep the console functional. MOM uses DTS package > jobs that run on schedule to copy the data to another SQL server. > > You have to keep in mind the rules-based to script-based agent as well. > AppManager agents are primarily script-based - which means they have > to run at set intervals to look for certain events. MOM agents are > primarily rules-based which means they deliver the information when > the event occurs. They both do a little of the other, too. > > At any rate, a hybrid product would be great... one that is as easy to > use as AppManager (drag and drop scripts on a machine) and one that > comes with as much "knowledge" as MOM. Hopefully MOM2004 delivers on > that... > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Glenn Corbett > Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 4:55 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] OT: NetIQ or MOM > > Chris, > > I've deployed both of these products in reasonably large > environments..... > > - Both NetIQ and MOM require a fair bit of setup to get the right > level of monitoring going > - Both require constant attention to be effective monitoring / > reporting platforms (they are not set-and-forget products) > - NetIQ's monitoring is more flexible and customisable IMHO. > - Both products are very expensive, with costs for base level OS > agents, plus additional costs for layered applications (like Exchange > / SQL) > - NetIQ is a very mature product, MOM is essentially v1.0 (take that > any way you want) > - the current version of MOM is basically an OEM version of NetIQ > - NetIQ's cross platform support is MILES / LEAGUES / KM (depending on > your unit of measurement) ahead of MOM, and will be for some time. > > There is a bunch of other things, it has been talked about on the list > previously (fairly recently actually). > > For my money, NetIQ is crrently the better prodct, but we all know > what happens once MS put their muscle behind a particular product sector. > That being said, NetIQ will probably be left standing, as they have a > great range of products and people, not just in the overlap with MOM. > > Glenn > > > On Fri, 2003-10-10 at 00:13, Chris Flesher wrote: > > We're looking at NetIQ for monitoring our Windows/SQL stuff, as well > > as what it can do on Unix (Solaris, AIX). However, with Microsoft > > going head on into monitoring, should I be worried about the affect > > this will have on NetIQ in the short/long term? Which is a better > > product right now? Which has better cross-platform support? > > > > We are a dominantly Windows in this department, with Unix in there > > as well. > > > > Thank you for any info you may have. > > > > Chris Flesher > > The University of Chicago > > NSIT/DCS > > 1-773-834-8477 > > > > List info : http://www.activedir.org/mail_list.htm > List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/list_faq.htm > List archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/activedir%40mail.activedir.org/ > > List info : http://www.activedir.org/mail_list.htm > List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/list_faq.htm > List archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/activedir%40mail.activedir.org/ List info : http://www.activedir.org/mail_list.htm List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/list_faq.htm List archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/activedir%40mail.activedir.org/ List info : http://www.activedir.org/mail_list.htm List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/list_faq.htm List archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/activedir%40mail.activedir.org/ List info : http://www.activedir.org/mail_list.htm List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/list_faq.htm List archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/activedir%40mail.activedir.org/
