Re: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...

Sat, 16 Sep 2006 10:02:54 -0700

Someday you need to take a spin through System.DirectoryServices.Protocols (.NET 2.0) in C# and see if you like it. It is a direct interop layer over wldap32, exposing the entire feature surface. It does impose an OO model on top of the API, but it is done in a very LDAP-centric way, using the connection as the core object and the metaphor of sending and receiving messages against that connection. Everything translates directly to what is actually going on. It is kind of the opposite of ADSI, in which the directory objects are the primary metaphor and all of the implementation details are buried in the abstraction. I can totally see why you wouldn't want to release a tool based on it, as you take hard dependencies on .NET 2.0 to use it, but one advantage is that you get free optimized X64 support with the same binaries. :) For your own stuff that never sees the light of day, it might be something you enjoy.
I totally hear you with PowerShell. My take on it is that the actual core of PowerShell is revolutionary and an extremely powerful and well-designed thing. It is also exceptionally harder to learn, so I think that is its greatest weakness. 


The actual providers that plug into the core are going to be hit and miss 
most likely.  The Exchange stuff is certainly implemented as an extension 
and is not part of the core, so any suckiness in the Exchange programming 
model for PowerShell has to fall on the Exchange team and not reflect on 
PowerShell as a whole.  The Exchange team seems to have a glorious history 
of providing us with terrible APIs (CDOEXM, WebDav, etc.), so I'm not at all 
surprised to hear that their PowerShell implementation will miss the mark.



My solution to this is to always try to avoid having to program Exchange.  I 
didn't even mention it in my book.  :)


Joe K.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "joe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: <ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 11:33 AM
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...



LOL.

I really actually like LDAP and Win32 API type coding. I do understand
though the draw for some folks for .NET. Just not for me, especially as I
play more and more in the FreeBSD space. ;)


ASP.NET I expect will be the first thing I go into when/if I make a step 
in

that direction. Something that is completely server side controlled.

I was into MONAD when it was first announced and very early in the

design/development/beta but they kept cutting back what they initially 
said
they were going to do with it and I ended up losing interest. I have fear 
in
how "fat" things are going to get with it. Certainly I am not thrilled 
with

the stuff being done in Exchange with it that I have seen/heard about. For
example, if I want a list of mailbox sizes of all mailboxes in an org you
need to pull back to the client running the script EVERYTHING about EVERY
mailbox. That may work in a small org but is not optimal in a large size
distributed environment. When I pointed that out I was simply told that is
the MONAD way... That isn't really encouraging for someone who normally
works on environments greater than 100k seats.


--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Kaplan
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 10:06 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...

I hope you aren't frustrated by the book being written in C# rather than

VB.NET.  That rule was imposed by my coauthor and the publisher.  All of 
the


code samples are re-written in VB.NET and posted on the website, so
hopefully that works for you.

For the most part, the actual VB and C# code aren't very different
(sometimes you just put a ";" at the end of the line :)), so hopefully
you'll be able to follow along with the gist of the C# in the book.

Someday I'd like to seriously tackle the .NET/scripting angle of DS
programming by tackling all this stuff from the PowerShell perspective.  I
think there's a huge audience for that in the future.  It will be

interesting to see how that works out as well, since the scripting world 
is
usually covered by other people (Joe, Robbie, Laura, etc.), but most of 
them



haven't done .NET yet.  The theme of my talk at DEC was suggesting that 
all

of the DS programmers will eventually end up in the .NET world, as that's
where all of Microsoft's programming model investment is going.  Joe
Richards will almost certainly be the last to go (unless he discovers how
cool PowerShell really is and becomes addicted).

Joe K.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Richard Kline" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: <ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 8:03 AM
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...


Please ignore this post:  I just read Joe's other note about
http://directoryprogramming.net/default.aspx

Sorry!   So much to read so little time...

Thanks!

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Kline
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 9:00 AM
To: 'ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org'
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...

Altering the subject a mite:
I've not yet purchased these books and so am not completely familiar
with the content...

Does anyone have a recommendation for AD programming using .NET?
VB is my personal poison of choice.

VBS would probably suffice for my anticipated needs but I do wish to get
more fully familiar with the .NET workings....

Thank you.

Richard

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of joe
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2006 11:02 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...

If you mean you purchased Active Directory Second Edition... Ebay it and
just start reading the Third Edition, I made considerable changes
through it and not just for new stuff. The security and schema chapters
and most all of the scripts got massive work done to them to correct
issues, etc.

Now if you mean you bought the AD Cookbook Second Edition, I would
actually recommend reading Active Directory Third Edition first, then
reading the cookbook as it will make more sense. Alternately, don't read
the cookbook and just treat it as a cookbook where when you need to do
something, you look up the recipe.

 joe


--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:26 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...

I have just purchased the 2nd one and will be on to the 3rd one as soon
as I have finished that...

Cheers,

Matt Duguid
Systems Engineer for Identity Services
Department of Internal Affairs

Phone: +64 4 4748028 (wellington)
Mobile: +64 21 1713290
Fax: +64 4 4748894
Address: Level 4, 47 Boulcott Street, Wellington CBD
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: http://www.dia.govt.nz/



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Actually I did the Active Directory Third Edition. The Active Directory
Cookbook is in the Second Edition now and that was done by Laura Hunter.
My book you can find in my signature, the Cookbook you can find at

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/059610202X/ref=pd_cp_b_title/002-499163
1-48

70433?ie=UTF8


--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 10:41 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...

hahaha no worries cheers for that i'll just swim around the fish bowl
one
more time...    ;-)

Matt Duguid
Systems Engineer for Identity Services
Department of Internal Affairs

Phone: +64 4 4748028 (wellington)
Mobile: +64 21 1713290
Fax: +64 4 4748894
Address: Level 4, 47 Boulcott Street, Wellington CBD
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: http://www.dia.govt.nz/



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|         |           15/09/2006 02:21 p.m.  |
|         |           Please respond to      |
|         |           ActiveDir              |
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*points at joe's signature...*

And in case that was too vague, try here.
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 9:13 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] Active Directory Cookbooks...


Hi there,

I have already read and use the "Active Directory Cookbook for Windows
2003 and Windows 2000" and see there are 2nd and 3rd editions. Is there
anywhere on the net which lists the contents of each so I can have a
look before purchase?

Thanks in advance,

Matt Duguid
Systems Engineer for Identity Services
Department of Internal Affairs

Phone: +64 4 4748028 (wellington)
Mobile: +64 21 1713290
Fax: +64 4 4748894
Address: Level 4, 47 Boulcott Street, Wellington CBD
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: http://www.dia.govt.nz/

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