RE: "And the thread did begin with Benjamin (?) talking about the "THE" concept of "authentic" where, to this moment, I'm not sure which notion he had in mind."
Don't worry, Cheerskep. Neither did he. DA On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 5:26 AM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In a message dated 6/28/08 7:59:38 PM, William writes: > >> Just hold on a second, Cheerskep. One may refer to >> THE concept in a discussion of a particular concept. >> One does not need to acknowledge all concepts or >> remind the reader that A concept simply means one of >> many, each time an already identified concept is >> mentioned. >> > I don't disagree with your core thought here, William, which is to say we can > have a serviceably clear discussion once the particular notion behind a given > word-use is effectively described. For example, if, when we are talking about > the "authenticity" of a given painting, all of us agree the notion intended > is "painted by the painter to whom the work is ascribed", we can get along all > right. But in the thread about 'authentic' it was clear that listers were > frequently talking at cross purposes -- especially when the focus drifted from > painting to "literature". "Jones was the authentic voice of the American > South." > "Smith's dialog simply isn't authentic. No one talks that way --" etc. > > And the thread did begin with Benjamin (?) talking about the "THE" concept of > "authentic" where, to this moment, I'm not sure which notion he had in mind. > But the thread spurted ahead as though everyone were talking about the same > thing. So I was just trying to teach you young fellers some safety techniques. > (See my original below.) I myself have tended to stick to the word 'notion' > rather than 'concept' for the very reason that our minds are less ready to > "objectify", "reify", a notion. But 'concept' is almost never used without the > definite article 'the' in front of it. And danger lies that way. > > I know I often mistype common words in these postings, but when it's a tricky > word, I'm more inclined to pay attention. Thus when you write, "Put away your > badge and have a sasprilila," as resident word-sheriff I feel compelled to > reply that it has been a very long time since I've had a sarsaparilla. >> >> >> >> WC >> >> >> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> >> > Chris is right to condemn this: >> > > "THE concept of.." rather than "A concept of.." >> > > >> > And Saul is right when he says, >> > >> > " There are other notions of authenticity such as >> > being true and >> > trustworthy,validated, genuine or that it >> > corresponds to a given model, or >> > is of a given period, or that it is what it >> > represents itself to be -" >> > >> > Whenever anyone talks of "THE concept of authentic" >> > or "THE meaning of >> > authentic" or "THE notion of authentic", you should >> > immediately get suspicious >> > about >> > the clarity of his thinking. >> > >> > The next step is to get suspicious whenever anyone >> > talks about "THE >> > concept/meaning/idea/notion" of ANYTHING. >> > >> > Most people are ready to concede that "notion", in >> > the sense of a fleeting >> > bit of consciousness, obtains only in a mind. >> > Granted, when I hear a given >> > word, >> > the notion that arises in my mind is likely to seem >> > near-identical to what >> > arose the last time I heard the word (though less >> > often than one might expect; >> > in my lifetime, the notion stirred by my hearing >> > 'Stalin', 'Enron', 'Muslim', >> > 'Islam', 'terrorism', 'cancer', 'liberal', 'Mel >> > Gibson', 'Supreme Court', >> > 'intelligence', and more has evolved a good deal). >> > >> > But there is something about our brains that tends >> > to "reify" a frequently >> > entertained notion, especially if we believe others >> > are entertaining the >> > "same" >> > notion. Thus 'a' concept becomes 'the' concept of >> > something. >> > >> > And so it is that, in a not-throught-through, fuzzy >> > way, we come think of >> > concepts and meanings as being extra-mental >> > entities. Discrete, stable words >> > -- >> > like 'authentic' -- are constant abetters to this >> > confusion. So when I say >> > 'authentic', I assume "THE meaning of" the word will >> > arise in your mind just >> > as it >> > was in my mind when I spoke. > > > ************** > Gas prices getting you down? > Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. > > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > -- Derek Allan http://www.home.netspeed.com.au/derek.allan/default.htm
