thanks for all the replies, this is a temporary link, just until more hops can be installed, i kind of want to just try it to see if it works, if i do it i will report back here
On Fri, Dec 7, 2018 at 6:13 PM Mathew Howard <mhoward...@gmail.com> wrote: > What Steve said. > > You probably can make it work, but you are more than likely going to waste > a lot of time and money fighting with it. > > On Fri, Dec 7, 2018 at 4:29 PM Steve Jones <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Linkplanner is probably one of the best things out there these days >> >> this link however is not, its being a terrible steward of the spectrum. >> You can do it, law even backs you, but should you? nope. >> Are you going to spend more money fighting this thing over the years than >> you would have on establishing a midpoint or alternative solution, 99.999% >> yes >> >> Trashing an entire band with noisy crickets to achieve a subpar link is >> just not being very neighborly at all. >> >> If its got feasibility in any way, find some transport within 5 or ten >> miles of either site, put up quality links to those endpoints and lease the >> transport, sell more on each end, save the spectrum for delivery >> >> On Fri, Dec 7, 2018 at 3:46 PM Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> LinkPlanner is great. >>> You can use it for your AirFiber too. Pick a Cambium product which lets >>> you set the same Tx Power as the AF and then pick an antenna with the >>> correct gain. Obviously it won't give you the correct mbps and reliability >>> numbers, but you'll get an RSL you can take to the bank. >>> >>> -Adam >>> >>> >>> On 12/7/2018 4:37 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: >>> >>> Use LinkPlanner and manually punch in the trees. If you're shooting >>> through them, get higher or find another way. >>> >>> Josh Luthman >>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>> 1100 Wayne St >>> Suite 1337 >>> Troy, OH 45373 >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 9:34 PM Brian Webster <i...@wirelessmapping.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> With tower coverage and radio mobile, path calculations and results are >>>> going to vary greatly by the amount of reliability you have set in the >>>> configuration. What you use for spot mode for ptmp is a lot different than >>>> if you want 99% or more uptime. Each decimal place in radio mobile wants >>>> another 10 dB signal to meet the reliability. This is a good tool to >>>> determine the path profile but you really want to use some other path calc >>>> tool that is designed for PTP links so that you get a reliable uptime >>>> calculation result. The Longley Rice propagation model used for Radio >>>> Mobile is not that good to reliability calculations in PTP paths. It’s >>>> usually conservative unless you have your availability numbers set too low >>>> say at 70 or 80%. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Long story short Kurt, find a path calc tool to run the signal numbers >>>> now that you have established you have a path. As Adam has said I would not >>>> be overly concerned with those trees in the path as much as having the >>>> right tool to show your predicted signal. A good path calc tool for PTPT >>>> gives you almost the exact numbers for signal you should have for >>>> alignment. Radio Mobile and by default tower coverage will not calculate >>>> the paths the same way. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Thank You, >>>> >>>> Brian Webster >>>> >>>> www.wirelessmapping.com >>>> >>>> www.Broadband-Mapping.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Kurt >>>> Fankhauser >>>> *Sent:* Thursday, December 06, 2018 4:32 PM >>>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com >>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] 25 mile shot AF5XHD NLOS ??? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> after looking at another tower i think i can go with the 3 foot dishes >>>> now. that puts me at -57 and tower coverage is supposed to be factoring in >>>> a little bit of tree fade so even if i fade 10db more im still at -67 which >>>> should be enough i would think. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 4:12 PM Mathew Howard <mhoward...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> So, to achieve 150Mbps each way, you would need 300Mbps aggregate with >>>> an AF5xHD, which means that you're going to need a minimum of a 40mhz >>>> channel at 8X (256QAM). to get 8X, you can use a maximum of 22dbm TX power, >>>> which by my calculations, would give you a signal of roughly -58 with 2' >>>> dishes - an AF5xHD is supposed to be able to do 8x at -65 on a 40mhz >>>> channel, so assuming no noise and clear LOS, that'd work just fine and give >>>> you a few db to spare. Realistically, you probably aren't going to get 8X >>>> on that link, so you'd need to bump it up to a 50mhz channel and hope 6X >>>> works. That lets you bump the TX power up a couple more db, and now you >>>> only need a -69 to get the desired capacity, which starts to look a lot >>>> more promising... but those trees could easily cost you more than 10db, and >>>> we don't know what kind of noise you're going to be dealing with. Going to >>>> 3' dishes on both ends should gain you 8db, but if you can't use 3' dishes, >>>> that doesn't really matter. My guess is that those trees are going to be >>>> cutting the signal down more than what 3' dishes would gain, but I don't >>>> believe that trees in towercoverage are accurate enough to really try to >>>> predict that. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Of course if you don't mind burning up the entire 5.8ghz band, you >>>> could use an 80mhz (or even 100mhz) channel, and then you'd only need 4X to >>>> get that kind of bandwidth, which would let you go up to 29dbm TX power, >>>> and you'd only need a signal of -71, which would mean you could afford to >>>> lose around 20db to the trees... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 2:40 PM Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> I got over 300mbps at 16.7 miles with 3' dishes on the AF5XHD. >>>> The catch is you need a large channel for these high data rates and you >>>> have to have a solid SNR across the whole channel. That's no guarantee. >>>> >>>> I don't think those intermittent trees in the bottom half of the >>>> Freznel zone are as big of a problem as people are making out. The bigger >>>> problem I see is the 2' dishes. I would not bet the farm on getting >>>> 150mbps out of it. >>>> >>>> -Adam >>>> >>>> On 12/6/2018 2:48 PM, Kurt Fankhauser wrote: >>>> >>>> Josh, who did you do that link for? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 2:38 PM Josh Luthman < >>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Not just no but hell no. 150 megs isn't going to happen. I wouldn't >>>> even count on it associating. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I did a 15 mile shot and I was a lot higher on both sides maybe half an >>>> hour from where you're at. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Josh Luthman >>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>> Suite 1337 >>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 2:20 PM Kurt Fankhauser < >>>> lists.wavel...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> found another site with better looking profile, 100 foot higher >>>> elevation on one of the ends. (see attached) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 2:04 PM Mathew Howard <mhoward...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> ubnt doesn't make a product that's going to work good for that >>>> situation... The only thing that might work better than AF5XHD for that is >>>> going to be AF-2X, or maybe AF-3X, but the chances of getting 150mbps out >>>> of either of those is pretty slim. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Now, as far as if AF5XHD's with 2' dishes will work... who knows, it >>>> depends on how much the trees actually block it, which probably isn't >>>> really possible to accurately predict. You're pretty much going to have to >>>> try it to know what it will do, but personally, I wouldn't do it unless I >>>> really had to. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 12:45 PM Timothy Steele < >>>> timothy.pct...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> everything about that email just wants to make me ask why-why oh why.. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I would use https://link.ubnt.com/ to find the product that would work >>>> best >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 1:31 PM Kurt Fankhauser < >>>> lists.wavel...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Trying to do a NLOS shot with AF5XHD's thats 25 miles (see attached >>>> topo). Only have done 10-12 mile shots before that are NLOS. I have had >>>> good success doing the 10 mile shots skimming tree tops but not sure if the >>>> added distance is going to drastically change that. According to >>>> TowerCoverage this link is showing it will work. Can't use 3 foot dishes >>>> due to wind loading only able to use 2 footers. Anyone think this should >>>> work? Only need about 150mbps each way. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> AF mailing list >>> AF@af.afmug.com >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >
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