The 25 people south of us also do not have PG&E (AKA power company to
the rest of the nation). So putting in anything that requires any kind
of power would be a non-starter. All of the people in that area also
provide their own power via solar, wind or hydro. I think all of them
also have generators as a backup. They have lots that range from 40
acres to maybe 120 or so acres, and there are no straight lines anywhere.
bp
<part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
On 1/9/2020 10:34 AM, [email protected] wrote:
It astounds me that RBOCs are still installing copper.
-----Original Message----- From: Bill Prince
Sent: Thursday, January 9, 2020 11:30 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cable TV Monies
That's been true around here for quite some time for att (formerly SBC,
formerly PacBell, formerly ATT). We have individual homes separated by
sometimes many miles. I often see a cable strewn over shrubs going for a
mile or so, just to provide POTS to one house. Every jack rabbit and/or
coyote along the way gets ample opportunity to mess up your crappy phone
service.
A group of neighbors just south of us (about 25 of them, spread over
several miles of mountainous terrain) got together and sued att to get
minimum POTS service. They (att) hired a contractor who came in with a
crew and they bored holes all over that area to replace the ancient
phone lines. Took them about a year or 18 months, probably because of
all the rock, and the service they have now is barely passable as POTS.
I think the majority have switched to VOIP that they do over wireless
internet.
bp
<part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
On 1/9/2020 10:13 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
Frontier gets away with ignoring POLR status. If the cable is bad
and there are only 3 or 4 customers on that segment of cable, they
just flat out tell those people they can't get phone service anymore
because they don't represent enough revenue to justify the repair
cost. I'm not talking about Internet, just basic POTS service.
-----Original Message-----
From: AF <[email protected]> On Behalf Of [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, January 9, 2020 12:01 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cable TV Monies
This nation has a history of fostering universal service for
utilities. The Rural Electrification Administration was created so
farmers could have a light bulb in the milking shed. Once the power
was rolling it was a simple thing to also add phone to it.
Phone went from open wire lines attached to the power poles, to
aerial and underground copper cable party lines, to larger cables
with single party service, to dial up and DSL on copper to fiber
optic cables carrying phone and data.
Pretty much the whole nation has a Provider of Last Resort (POLR)
designated for every habitable area. Those areas are served for
Incumbent Local Exchange Carriers and they have a duty to serve. No
matter what the expense, if the hermit on the mountain wants a phone
he gets a phone. It is a utility. The universal service fund
replaces what was the old AT&T line haul agreements that originally
subsidized service in rural areas with long distance revenue. Once
divesture hit that whole thing got changed to a system of explicit
subsidies. The USF and grants still service to provide telephone
service to every last barn and sage brush irrespective of whether or
not there is a business case to do so.
Those that hold CPCNs (Certificate of Public Convenience and
Necessity) to serve a geographical area as an ILEC and POLR have the
golden ticket. There may still be a few unserved areas where you
could also become an ILEC. Or you can buy one. They have a pretty
sweet deal.
TV has never been considered a utility.
-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Hoppes
Sent: Thursday, January 9, 2020 10:47 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cable TV Monies
So why are we not seeing the same thing with fiber optic then? Why
are we needing USDA grants? Here in PA much of rural areas are
covered by Zito Media that was various smaller cable companies.
On Jan 9, 2020, at 12:43 PM, Ken Hohhof <[email protected]> wrote:
I think it was all private money. Lots of little cable companies that
were acquired to form the big ones we have now. For example, Comcast
in my area used to be Jones Intercable:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jones_Intercable
I don't know of any cable TV systems in very rural areas. They
typically cover towns but not the outside areas. Not profitable to
run coax where there aren't a lot of people. Franchise agreements
might have required them to cover the entire incorporated area of the
town, otherwise they might not even extend to the edge of town.
I'm guessing cable TV systems were pretty profitable, hence lots of
people started them. And originally cable franchises were like a
monopoly, you didn't have to compete with 10 other providers on price,
and it was an asset you could sell. Even today, the big cable
companies have an unwritten agreement to mostly not compete in each
others territory.
In my WISP service area we have a small cable company that covers 4
towns.
Not the rural areas, just the towns. It is basically owned and run by
one guy, I think the cable system was bankrupt and shut down for
several years before that.
www.heartlandcable.com
There were a number of cable TV "magnates", the most famous maybe
being John Malone, aka "The Cable Cowboy".
-----Original Message-----
From: AF <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Thursday, January 9, 2020 11:13 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AFMUG] Cable TV Monies
I know there are USF funds that have been used to build out internet
and phone and other funding for electric.
How did the early cable systems get funded? I’m not necessarily
talking about associations although certainly to some extent, but like
full on analog cable TV systems in very rural area.
The cost of copper is worse than fiber. How were these systems bank
rolled? Sometimes by a single private person.
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