LOL !! From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown Sent: Friday, September 11, 2015 12:04 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: a new one, I think...
You could add solar to the generator. Lots of folks do a mixed system like that in off grid situations. Here is one, put a pulley at the top and bottom of the tower. Connect the pulleys with a nylon rope. Power the bottom with a motor and put a generator at the top! In addition to powering your tower top gear fully isolated, if you had a plastic tower and sprayed ions on the rope at the top, the whole works could be a nice van de graff generator. Make your tower climber’s hair stand on end. From: Paul McCall<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 10:00 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: a new one, I think... OK. That makes sense. Will cycle the batteries more often of course. That goes in the consideration pile too now ☺ Solar seems to be less practical possibly than was expressed to me by the consultant today. From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 11:56 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: a new one, I think... You could have a propane generator charge the batts for a hour or two each day. Put it on a timer. Probably be less cost and more reliable than solar. From: Chuck McCown<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:51 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... Yep. Transformers pass pulses pretty well. If you get a common mode choke it helps. From: Paul McCall<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:47 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... “Bad things can pass transformers”, meaning pass isolation transformers as well? From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 11:45 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... The transformer on the top of the pole can be considered an isolation transformer. The transformer in the rectifier/charger can be considered an isolation transformer. Bad things can pass transformers. From: Paul McCall<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 8:24 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... Where in line to use it? We haven’t had great luck with placing those at the start of the AC path. From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Lewis Bergman Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 10:23 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... Why don't you use an isolation transformer? Much cheaper than solar and less tricky than hanging it on a tower. On Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 9:04 PM Paul McCall <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: We charge our batteries now and a 24v array using a Samlex charger. But, that doesn’t isolate it from grid power. The charger (powered by 110) 24v output goes to the same “bus” that feeds the batteries. So, BOTH charger output and battery output are “on” at the same time. I asked here last week about a way to just run off the batteries, and no workable solution was found. From: Af [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Cameron Crum Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:59 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... If you are just looking for AC power isolation, then why not just a bank of batteries charged by grid power? This would isolate you from powerline surges. Cell sites have been running this way since the beginning of time. On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 8:38 PM, Paul McCall <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: In most cases, yes we own the tower. From: Af [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Lewis Bergman Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:32 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... Do you own this tower? I can't imagine what I would charge someone to put a solar site on one of my towers. On Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 8:19 PM Josh Luthman <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: If you get enough panels and batteries you'll be fine. If you cheap out and don't get enough battery run time you'll hate yourself. You're in Florida so I think with the lack of winter and a proper budget (batteries) you'll have no problems. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340<tel:937-552-2340> Direct: 937-552-2343<tel:937-552-2343> 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 9:18 PM, Paul McCall <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: You are correct on your calculations… my spreadsheet formula was wrong ☺ I just came up with 104 watts. I will ask the question naively.. why would you expect a headache? Isn’t solar tried and true these days? I am dealing with every aspect of surge protection I possibly can at every level already, as this summer has been a monster for us on surges. So, am doing the fiber up the tower in some cases, so I WILL have gear up there, which has its own sets of “concerns” regardless of how I power them. So, is a solar setup not reliable? The “expert” claims that he seeing it more and more in the cellular world, up the tower Paul From: Af [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Josh Baird Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:10 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] a new one, I think... I would at least allow 7.5W per ePMP radio (specs say 7.5 is typical, can spike to 10), and 10-15W per 320. Maybe another 5-10w per MT radio. That would be close to 100W. You don't want to underestimate power consumption. Regarding your solar question.. I'm not sure, but that sounds like one hell of a headache. Josh On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 9:00 PM, Paul McCall <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: OK, so I am working with a grounding expert today, getting some opinions on a couple difficult towers, and one of the first suggestions he has for me as I mention that I am looking to do fiber / DC up this tower is… “Have you considered going solar up the tower?” (to eliminate power surges completely from going up the tower) Hmmmm… So my brain starts wrestling with that… Is it practical? Say on a tower with a Netonix DC powered switch running at 48v or 24v, powering 6 ePMP APs and 2 320APs, 2 Mikrotik Bhs, and a small Mikortik router. Would be about 50 watts maximum according to my quick calcs. Not knowing anything about solar, has battery technology developed enough that it would be practical (size wise) to have enough batteries and a charge controller up in a box on a tower? And what size solar panel would I need to drive that? Paul Paul McCall, Pres. PDMNet / Florida Broadband 658 Old Dixie Highway Vero Beach, FL 32962 772-564-6800<tel:772-564-6800> office 772-473-0352<tel:772-473-0352> cell www.pdmnet.com<http://www.pdmnet.com/> [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
