So, the issue, is that they enforced policy that they originally thought they could try to let you slide on. IPPay has no control over VISA/MC/AMEX, so when they say no, it's their fault. Got it. I'll bow out of this one, because I fail to see the logic of breaking the rules, getting caught, they tried to help, and then they couldn't process the transaction. Now you quit doing business with them over a non-business related transaction. I've worked with probably 15 different merchant processors over the last 20 years, and none of them have ever allowed this. I wouldn't quit a company that wouldn't help me break card processing rules, even if they originallly tried to help me break them.
On Sunday, April 17, 2016, Jason McKemie <[email protected]> wrote: > The issue is how it was handled. > > On Saturday, April 16, 2016, Chuck Hogg <[email protected] > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','[email protected]');>> wrote: > >> Um, so if you don't seewhy this isn't allowed, I don't know what to say. >> And to quit a processor over running an unnatural charge that wasn't a >> normal part of your charge history is crazy. I bet they tried to help you >> and thats why the runnaround only to be told by their bank that its a >> no-no. Its also in most merchant agreements. >> >> >> >> On Saturday, April 16, 2016, Jason McKemie < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> I would have done the same thing. >>> >>> On Saturday, April 16, 2016, Jeremy <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Sorry, but this is a ridiculous reason to leave IPPay. Also, it is a >>>> grey area when it comes to legality. >>>> >>>> On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 8:55 PM, That One Guy /sarcasm < >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> ther may be ftc regulations that would create a criminal liability for >>>>> processors allowing kiting >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 8:05 PM, Tyson @ Internet Communications Inc >>>>> (ICI) <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> My 2 cents: >>>>>> >>>>>> Who cares! The merchant gets their damn money. Unless you have some >>>>>> kind of charge back history, it's stupid. The only thing I will say, as >>>>>> an outsider, if you did it for the rewards perk...why? >>>>>> >>>>>> Doesn't the reward get off set by the merchant fees? It's a wash. >>>>>> >>>>>> If the intent was for something else, it's really none of their >>>>>> business. They make money. >>>>>> >>>>>> Disclaimer: I don't use them >>>>>> >>>>>> *Tyson Burris, President* >>>>>> *Internet Communications Inc.* >>>>>> *739 Commerce Dr.* >>>>>> *Franklin, IN 46131* >>>>>> >>>>>> *317-738-0320 <317-738-0320> Daytime #* >>>>>> *317-412-1540 <317-412-1540> Cell/Direct #* >>>>>> *Online: **www.surfici.net* >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Forgive the brevity, the typos and my fat fingers! >>>>>> >>>>>> On Apr 15, 2016, at 4:43 PM, Scott Vander Dussen <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I’ve received a few off-list request for my story and a couple here >>>>>> on-list. I don’t mind sharing, I just didn’t want to come out with a >>>>>> rant >>>>>> about IPPay because that wasn’t my goal. I share this experience >>>>>> because I >>>>>> really value this list and the contributions made by all you wonderful >>>>>> people. Few things have shaped my business and been as valuable of a >>>>>> resource as this list (beginning as Part-15.org <http://part-15.org> >>>>>> to current), so thank you everyone! (: Part of that awesomeness is >>>>>> sometimes sharing the less than stellar experiences we face, here’s mine >>>>>> with IP Pay. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. I wanted to make a purchase that was not eligible for a CC payment >>>>>> and get the cash back rewards >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 2. I contacted Cap1 and asked if I could use one of those blank >>>>>> “courtesy checks” they send out to write to myself and basically get a >>>>>> cash >>>>>> advance plus then get the cash back rewards. They said no problem, but >>>>>> the >>>>>> checks are exempt from cash back rewards. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 3. I asked if I as a business could run my own card into my own bank >>>>>> account for the cash rewards. She said no problem, I asked her to >>>>>> research >>>>>> the Cap 1 Visa ToS to verify, she did and again no problem. I then asked >>>>>> her to triple verify by confirming with her supervisor, and again no >>>>>> problem. They said if you have that resource to process your own card >>>>>> and >>>>>> you’re paying your minimum balances etc. it’s a non-issue. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 4. I researched “Credit Card Kiting” which is the process of paying a >>>>>> credit card balance with another credit card- the practice is only a >>>>>> problem when there is deception involved. Even the Wikipedia article >>>>>> demonstrates its OK when there is not deception. And this isn’t even >>>>>> kiting, it’s just processing a credit card for cash in the bank. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 5. We process a card for $20k >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 6. Tanya Krapil from IPPay halts the transaction, holds the funds >>>>>> and emails me asking if it’s legit. (lost a whole day of expected funds >>>>>> because of this) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 7. I reply it’s legit. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 8. Tayan demands invoices and “documentation” before she will release >>>>>> the funds. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 9. I reply: “We don't share our invoices with parties not involved >>>>>> with the transaction, that is not only a breach of confidentiality but >>>>>> inappropriate for you to ask. While I can appreciate your concern for >>>>>> fraud >>>>>> I have, as the CEO of Velociter, already confirmed the legitimacy of this >>>>>> transaction. If at this time you are cause further delays in processing >>>>>> this transaction then I will consider your actions as unreasonable >>>>>> non-performance and a termination of our long standing business >>>>>> relationship.” >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 10. Tayna the replies that she will process this transaction. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 11. Subsequently Tayna spoke telephonically with other staff and >>>>>> determined the card was employee owned. Tayna said she’d process the >>>>>> payment but it isn’t a kosher practice. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 12. Tayna then emails me to tell me just kidding, she’s not going to >>>>>> process the payment after all. (losing yet another day of expected funds) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> My grief is that on a $20k tag Tayna doesn’t bother to pick up the >>>>>> phone and call, just arbitrarily held the funds and sent an email. Then >>>>>> she said two times that she would indeed process the payment only to then >>>>>> change her mind later. It’s horrible customer service to say one thing >>>>>> and >>>>>> then not honor it, even if you made a mistake. I’m particularly bothered >>>>>> by her asking for “invoices and documentation” to support the charge; the >>>>>> US in particular is getting so used to sacrificing our privacy and >>>>>> freedoms. Tayna is demanding I send over information that completely out >>>>>> of her sphere of concern. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Tayna is citing that it’s a Visa policy not process your own card, >>>>>> but has provided no documentation to support that. There is no deception >>>>>> involved, we called and pre-authorized the transaction with Cap1 on a >>>>>> recorded call and Cap1 gave their blessing. I contract with IPPay to >>>>>> process the CC cards I enter, nothing more. Even if there is some >>>>>> obscure >>>>>> Visa ToS that prohibits this transaction for this specific reason (this >>>>>> is * >>>>>> *not** credit card kiting) Tayna’s lack of professionalism and the >>>>>> subsequent headache it’s caused me finished my company’s business >>>>>> relationship with IPPay. And I would greatly question who is the >>>>>> enforcement of Visa’s ToS, the merchant or the issuing bank. I’d lean >>>>>> heavily towards the issuing bank. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Anyhow, thanks for the feedback and suggestions of other merchants. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Scott >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *From:* Af [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett >>>>>> *Sent:* Friday, April 15, 2016 11:35 >>>>>> *To:* [email protected] >>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Merchant services >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Same. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- >>>>>> Mike Hammett >>>>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >>>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> >>>>>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> >>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> >>>>>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >>>>>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >>>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> >>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> >>>>>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >>>>>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >>>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >>>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>>> >>>>>> *From: *"Jason Wilson" <[email protected]> >>>>>> *To: *[email protected] >>>>>> *Sent: *Friday, April 15, 2016 1:22:03 PM >>>>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Merchant services >>>>>> >>>>>> Scott, I am an IPPay client, email privately your decision to move. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Jason >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Jason Wilson >>>>>> >>>>>> Remotely Located >>>>>> >>>>>> Providing High Speed Internet to out of the way places. >>>>>> >>>>>> 530-651-1736 >>>>>> >>>>>> 530-748-9608 Cell >>>>>> >>>>>> www.remotelylocated.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 11:08 AM, Josh Reynolds <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Authorize.net <http://authorize.net>? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 1:02 PM, Scott Vander Dussen >>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> > Without all the nasty details, I'm completely done doing business >>>>>> with IPPay. Any recommendations for alternatives? >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Thanks, >>>>>> > 'S >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Sent mobile! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your >>>>> team as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> -- >> Regards, >> Chuck >> > -- Regards, Chuck
