The FCC for 5 GHz in Part 15 defines the regulation and power level not by beamwidth , but by application as multipoint, so regardless of beamwidth you can do with beamforming (even if it’s only a few degrees for that matter), if it’s in a single product enclosure, it’s still a multipoint system and subject to lower power levels than PTP.
On the client side however, in the U-NII 3, a client of a multipoint system can be classified as PTP device as it directionally communicates to only one device. In the latest OOBE NPRM, the FCC added a clarification for the U-NII 1, a client of a multipoint system is now also considered part of multipoint system, regardless if it’s only transmitting to one device directionally. So it may be that even U-NII 1 clients should be at the lower power level. You can thank our friends in the Set Top Box industry as they tried to get this expanded for higher power for them, and the FCC rejected it and tightened th`e rules even further to make a point. So even between U-NII 1 and U-NII 3 in 5 GHz, there’s some difference in language and confusion. Jaime On June 27, 2016 at 9:29:21 AM, Josh Reynolds ([email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>) wrote: ... What? On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 11:10 AM, Rory Conaway <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: The beam pattern size in 5GHz doesn’t matter. Rory From: Af [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, June 27, 2016 8:51 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m I'd assume so, but I don't know. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL> Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix> The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png] <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> ________________________________ From: "Bill Prince" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Monday, June 27, 2016 10:49:23 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m Are the approximate 12° beams small enough to qualify for PTP rules? bp <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> On 6/27/2016 8:46 AM, Mike Hammett wrote: 4 chains over 360 degrees vs. 14 chains over 90 degrees. The Quamni doesn't really count when looking at a non-micro-POP model. It wouldn't be narrow enough to qualify for any PtP rules. To me it's preferential in situations where cost or aesthetics are important, but not for performance (RF or IP). It's technically similar, but that's comparing a Cruze and a Vette in that they're both cars. That said, it'll be a closer comparison when the 8x8 A5c is available and on a 90* sector. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL> Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix> The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png] <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> ________________________________ From: "Rory Conaway" <[email protected]><mailto:[email protected]> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Monday, June 27, 2016 10:29:55 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m Please explain. 4 sectors, lights up the 1 or 2 sectors the CPE connects to. Or are you referring to the sector being 90 degrees instead of something like 10 degrees? Just for the record, 2.4GHz has much more benefit with beam steering antennas than 5GHz. 2.4GHz can bring the power output up and take advantage of PTP rules unless that has changed. Rory From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, June 27, 2016 6:15 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m Not even close. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL> Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix> The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png] <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> ________________________________ From: "Rory Conaway" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2016 9:00:40 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m I think it’s called an Mimosa A5. Rory From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2016 6:13 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m I would love to see an omni beemsteering antenna in 5ghz. On Thu, Jun 23, 2016 at 12:42 AM, Ken Hohhof <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: As wide as 360 degrees? From:Forrest Christian (List Account)<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 10:04 PM To:af<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m That is why they said 'about 3-4 times the throughput'. The better the spacial diversity the better the throughput - they can get 7x if everything is aligned correctly. You also need to remember that these aren't fixed beams - they're dynamically pointable, and my understanding is that it can be re-pointed in each timeslot, so as long as all of your customers aren't in a very narrow slice, and are relatively spread out, you should gain something. The other thought is that this is going to encourage people to move to as wide of sector as possible to improve the beamsteering performance. On Wed, Jun 22, 2016 at 11:33 AM, Kurt Fankhauser <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: So if i have a tower like the one below with customers spaced out accordingly, alot of the customers are going to fall wthin 1 or 2 of the 6 degree "strip patches" on the antenna and thus i wont see as much throughput increase per AP? :( On Wed, Jun 22, 2016 at 1:28 PM, Bill Prince <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: You can't do that kind of spatial diversity in a PTP link. bp <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> On 6/22/2016 10:11 AM, Kurt Fankhauser wrote: Will there be a PTP version of Medusa that can triple the throughput of existing PTP650 links on the same channel width? I am wondering why the same massive-mimo can't be applied to PTP so a 450mbps PTP650 link running on 45mhz channel can then achieve 1.35Gbps on the same 45mhz channel? On Wed, Jun 22, 2016 at 1:05 PM, Josh Luthman <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Are these uplink and downlink? The epmp 2000 is only uplink. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340<tel:937-552-2340> Direct: 937-552-2343<tel:937-552-2343> 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Jun 22, 2016 12:54 PM, "Peter Kranz" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: With the ETI beamformer antenna.. you get ~20db gain since you have the electrical capture of all the active antennas going on.. in theory creating a high gain very narrow spot beam of 15 degrees or so.. 14 implies something else.. Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com<http://www.UnwiredLtd.com> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100<tel:510-868-1614%20x100> Mobile: 510-207-0000<tel:510-207-0000> [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> From: Af [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Bill Prince Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 9:51 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m They beam-form the power coming in. bp <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> On 6/22/2016 9:40 AM, Craig Schmaderer wrote: Over poe though? That’s pushing a lot of watts over it, I didn’t hear them say it had a separate power port? From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 11:40 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m 48v to 56 or 59v I believe On Wed, Jun 22, 2016 at 11:38 AM, Craig Schmaderer <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Spec sheet says 70watts, how are we going to power this thing, they never said the power options did they? From: Af [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Daniel White Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 11:37 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m Yes there is a GigE roadmap that includes 40MHz channels. Daniel White Managing Director – Hardware Distribution Sales ConVergence Technologies Cell: +1 (303) 746-3590<tel:%2B1%20%28303%29%20746-3590> [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> From: Af [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 10:30 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m Any plans to offer 40mhz channel on this thing for 800-1000mbps throughput? On Wed, Jun 22, 2016 at 12:22 PM, Mike Hammett <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: That does a lot of nothing now. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL> Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix> The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> [http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png] <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> ________________________________ From: "Bill Prince" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 11:21:33 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450m Take whatever you like from here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO9JfpcaZRA bp <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> On 6/22/2016 9:17 AM, Matt wrote: There is a webinar going on now as we speak introducing the product. Is there anywhere to download slides or video from the webinar? [https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/2016/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange_184x116-v1.png]<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=icon> Virus-free. www.avast.com<http://www.avast.com> -- Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc. Tel: 406-449-3345<tel:406-449-3345> | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602 [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> | http://www.packetflux.com [https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/linkedin.png]<http://www.linkedin.com/in/fwchristian> [https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/facebook.png] <http://facebook.com/packetflux> [https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/twitter.png] <http://twitter.com/@packetflux>
