Steve,
You seem to agree on the requirements of an O.D. & E.M..
Your “solution” : “bring in a project manager” - is hardly practical. How’s
that going to help or be possible for almost anyone here? {Nice if you can get
one, most can’t].
I am talking about, via a review system, establishing an inventive *culture* of
properly targeted problems and solutions – which will become a part of each
individual and influence their practice and projects.
It isn’t that hard to do. And it will make a vast difference.
You’ve just seen with Alan, who was at least brave enough to put his thoughts
forward, – another example of confused, vague operational definitions. If you
can’t define the problem, you can’t propose an EM or solve it – you can only
waste life.
Please think again re a review system..
From: Steve Richfield
Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 10:17 PM
To: AGI
Subject: Re: [agi] re: The Two Prerequisites to start an AGI project
Mike,
I think you may be over-analyzing. IMHO "all" AGI needs is a good project
manager, who will INSIST on not only proof of concept, but enough details to be
able to produce believable project guesstimates, etc.
Of course there are no good project managers in AGI, and there can never be
unless/until AGI reforms enough to permit one to operate.
Steve
=======================
On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 4:01 AM, Mike Tintner <[email protected]> wrote:
[cont]
OTOH if Gutenberg had said: “look, I think this machine I’m designing will
really be better for printing - look at the wheel assemblies, I’m proposing...
look at the additional power they will produce.. look at the speed of these
levers.. look at the quality of the ink ingredients... look at the fonts...
read my book on font patterns... read my book on wheel mechanisms ..look at my
“logic gates”... read my book on logic.. look at the long list of my academic
papers and citations”....
you’d have to say: “fuck off, Gutenberg, where’s your proof of concept?”
Or to be more precise still, a would-be inventor must have:
2) a proof of concept, with an EFFECTIVE MECHANISM ... a mechanism that
will produce the desired effect - enable your machine to perform its function
as specified in your operational definition. A wine-press-type-press
constitutes an “effective mechanism” for pressing seals down faster. “Faster
wheel assembles” do not. They do not connect in any necessary way to the seals.
All this applies equally to theorising about AGI, as well as AGI projects. No
one who merely theorises about AGI has either an operational definition or a
proof of concept/effective mechanism.
Jim has never offered an operational definition of AGI of any kind, hasn’t in
fact a clue what an AGI problem is.
And he proposes a vague mechanism – essentially “complexity reduction” –
without the slightest proof of concept /explanation of how this “mechanism”
will be effective in solving any AGI problem – or how complexity is actually
involved in any AGI problem.
Jim is typical. Ben couldn’t begin to explain how probabilistic logic will
solve any AGI problem.
And the amazing thing is no one has any shame about this. A recognition of
some kind of operational definition/proof-of-concept protocols would produce
the necessary shame
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