I don't think this would help get to AGI, but instead would be very useful to incorporate into an AGI. It could map on top of the semantic structure to improve communication. Have the semantic understanding at the base and map different language syntax in parallel to the semantics. The AI would then have one understanding that could be communicated in whatever manner was best suited to the audience, be it using the base internally or Spanish to El Presidente (or whatever).
But I really can't see it being of use in developing the actual AGI. Also, only let it get syntax from scanning Mark Twain, that way what ever it says will be entertaining. :) On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 2:09 AM, Hector Zenil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I might be wrong but after reading some of the ADIOS papers I cannot > tell the difference between their approach and the common Bayesian > practice of looking at n-grams frequencies in computational > linguistics, often used (for instance by Google) for spell/grammar > checking, word/sentence suggestions, web related content (like the > Google sets project), word/phrase disambiguation and so on. In other > words, if you google sentences and pick the ones with higher > frequencies coming from their corpus (their indexed web) you will end > up with the right ones--spelling and grammar speaking. The same for > the interchangeability approach also based in gram frequency > (including this "end phrase" idea) that allows the method to generate > new well formed sentences. > > Anyway, I agree that this doesn't solve the semantical problem, but I > do think it points to the right direction since this n-grams can be > thought as having a joint meaning so they can be treated as semantical > atoms. > > Perhaps the novelty from ADIOS is that they have implemented a package > and they have found several nice applications? but I don't think they > have something to patent other than the package itself, but if they > do, they shouldn't (I just have troubles when people want to patent > algorithms). > > > > On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 1:29 AM, Ben Goertzel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I looked through the ADIOS papers... > > > > It's interesting work, and it reminds me of a number of other things, > including > > > > -- Borzenko's work, http://proto-mind.com/SAHIN.pdf > > > > -- Denis Yuret's work on mutual information based grammar learning, > > from the late 90's > > > > -- Robert Hecht-Nielsen's much-publicized work a couple years back, on > > automated language learning and generation > > > > -- Tony Smith's work on automated learning of function-word based > > grammars from text, done in his MS thesis from University of Calgary > > in the 90's > > > > Looking at these various things together, it does seem clear that one > > can extract a lot of syntactic structure from free text in an > > unsupervised manner. > > > > It is unclear whether one can get the full syntactic subtlety of > > everyday English though. Every researcher in this area seems to get > > to a certain stage (mining the simpler aspects of English syntax), and > > then never get any further. > > > > However, I have another complaint to make. Let's say you succeed with > > this, and make an English-language-syntax recognizer that works, say, > > as well as the link parser, by pure unsupervised learning. That is > > really cool but ... so what? > > > > Syntax parsing is already not the bottleneck for AGI, we already have > > decent parsers. The bottleneck is semantic understanding. > > > > Having a system that can generate random sentences is not very useful, > > nor is having a bulky inelegant automatically learned formal-grammar > > model of English. > > > > If one wants to hand-craft mapping rules taking syntax parses into > > logical relations, one is better off with a hand-crafted grammar than > > a messier learned one. > > > > If one wants to have the mapping from syntax into semantics be > > learned, then probably one is better off having syntax be learned in a > > coherent overall experiential-learning process -- i.e. as part of a > > system learning how to interact in a world -- rather than having > > syntax learned in an artificial, semantics-free manner via > > corpus-mining. > > > > In other words: suppose you could make ADIOS work for real ... how > > would that help along the path of AGI? > > > > -- Ben G > > > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 8:46 AM, Evgenii Philippov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 7:37 PM, Ben Goertzel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > For instance, I'll be curious whether ADIOS's automatically > inferred > > > > grammars can deal with recursive phrase structure, with > constructs > > > > like "the person with whom I ate dinner", and so forth.... > > > > > > ADIOS papers have a lot of remarks like "recusion is not > implemented", > > > but I think it IS able to deal with THIS kind of recusion... But > this > > > is TBD---I am not sure. > > > > > > > > > > > > e > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 7:57 AM, Evgenii Philippov < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hello folks, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:06 PM, Ben Goertzel < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > In general, I personally have lost interest in automated > inference of grammars > > > > > > from text corpuses, though I did play with that in the 90's > (and got bad results > > > > > > like everybody else). > > > > > > > > > > Uh oh! My current top-priority is playing with ADIOS algorithm > for > > > > > unsupervised grammar learning, which is based on extended > Hidden > > > > > Markov Models. Its results are plainly fantastic---it is able > to > > > > > create a working grammar not only for English, but also for > many other > > > > > languages, plus languages with spaces removed, plus DNA > structure, > > > > > protein structure, etc etc etc. Some results are described in > Zach > > > > > Solan's papers and the algorithm itself is described in his > > > > > dissertation. > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tau.ac.il/~zsolan/papers/ZachSolanThesis.pdf<http://www.tau.ac.il/%7Ezsolan/papers/ZachSolanThesis.pdf> > > > > > http://adios.tau.ac.il/ > > > > > > > > > > And its grammars are completely comprehensible for a human. > (See the > > > > > homepage, papers and the thesis for diagrams.) > > > > > > > > > > Also, they can very easily be used for language generation, > and Z > > > > > Solan did a lot of experiments with this. > > > > > > > > > > It has no relation to Link Grammar though. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Automated inference of grammar from language used in > embodied situations > > > > > > interests me a lot ... and "cheating" via using > hand-created NLP tools may > > > > > > be helpful too... > > > > > > > > > > > > But I sort of feel like automated inference of grammars > from corpuses may > > > > > > be a HARDER problem than learning grammar based on embodied > experience... > > > > > > which is hard enough... > > > > > > > > > > ADIOS solves this hard problem easily. Some or all > modifications of > > > > > ADIOS are memory-intensive though, I did not implement it > completely > > > > > yet. > > > > > > > > > > I am doing it in Java. > > > > > > > > > > Also, Google Scholar http://scholar.google.com/ shows no > evidence of > > > > > substantial subsequent work of other people in the direction > of ADIOS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OTOH we're talking about research here and nobody's > intuition is perfect ... > > > > > > so what you're describing could potentially be a great GSOC > project mentored > > > > > > by YOU not me .. I don't want to impose my own personal > intuition and taste > > > > > > on the whole OpenCog GSOC enterprise... > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > Gamma > > > > > Evgenii Philippov > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > Ben Goertzel, PhD > > > > CEO, Novamente LLC and Biomind LLC > > > > Director of Research, SIAI > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > "If men cease to believe that they will one day become gods then > they > > > > will surely become worms." > > > > -- Henry Miller > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > Evgenii Philippov > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "OpenCog.org (Open Cognition Project)" group. > > > To post to this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/opencog?hl=en > > > -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Ben Goertzel, PhD > > CEO, Novamente LLC and Biomind LLC > > Director of Research, SIAI > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > "If men cease to believe that they will one day become gods then they > > will surely become worms." > > -- Henry Miller > > > > ------------------------------------------- > > agi > > Archives: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > > RSS Feed: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ > > Modify Your Subscription: http://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > > > > ------------------------------------------- > agi > Archives: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > RSS Feed: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ > Modify Your Subscription: > http://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > ------------------------------------------- agi Archives: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ Modify Your Subscription: http://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=98558129-0bdb63 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
