Hi, OK, I read the supposed refutation of recursive self-improvement at
http://www.mattmahoney.net/rsi.html There are at least three extremely major problems with the argument. 1) By looking only at algorithmic information (defined in terms of program length) and ignoring runtime complexity, you are ignoring much of the value to be achieved via RSI. Suppose program P1 can solve problems of class C and size 500 in 3 hours per problem. Then, suppose P1 spends 50 hours transforming itself into a new program,P2, that can solve problems of class C and size 500 in one second per problem. Furthermore, suppose the RAM available in the machine at hand cannot hold bothP1 and P2 at the same time. In this case, it's obvious there's a huge advantage involved in P1 replacing itself withP2 ... if solving problems of class C is important for P1 achieving its goals, and if P2 is oriented toward achieving the same goal. Your argument is blind to this advantage because it ignores runtime complexity. Your argument is fixated on the fact that P2 can be generated by information consistingof {P1 plus the data P1 has observed} ... but so what? Program length is not, initself, all that useful thing to be looking at in the context of real-world computing. We need to be thinking about both space and time complexity. 2) You don't consider the program as interacting with an environment. IMO you shouldbe using the mathematical setup that Hutter uses in his main theorems about AIXI and AIXItl. In this setup, the AI is an agent that takes actions in an environment, which then responds to its actions. Furthermore, you should enhance Hutter's setup to consider the case where the agenthas not only fixed RAM (together potentially with a larger amount of memory that is slower to access), but also has processing cycle that is defined in terms of the "cycle time" of the environment, so that it only gets N internal processing cycles per each opportunity to sense/act. Considering the argument in this kind of more realistic setting, the critical importance of runtime as I noted above would immediately become apparent. 3) You don't consider that a smarter program might be able to figure out ways to increase its processor speed or RAM capacity, thus breaking your theoretical assumptions altogether. In this case, P2 could have an arbitrarily larger algorithmic information than P1, contradicting your result (by using a different, more realistic assumption). ... In short, what you have shown is that, according to an uninteresting measure (algorithmic information), RSI is not very dramatically useful in an artificial situation (no environment, no restrictions on processor cycle consumption, no ability for intelligence to lead to hardware modification). -- Ben G p.s. I read many PDF files each day using the same OS and viewer, and have never before seen the kind of problem I did with your pdf file. But I don't know what the source of the problem was. Anyway I read the HTML file just fine, thanks! On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 1:29 PM, Matt Mahoney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > --- On Mon, 10/13/08, Ben Goertzel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I was eager to debunk your supposed debunking of recursive > self-improvement, but I found that when I tried to open that PDF file, it > looked like a bunch of gibberish (random control characters) in my PDF > reader (Preview on OSX Leopard) > > That's odd. Maybe you should run Windows :-( > > Anyway I posted an HTML version. Not sure why PDF wouldn't work. I created > both in OpenOffice. > > http://www.mattmahoney.net/rsi.pdf > http://www.mattmahoney.net/rsi.html > > Anyone else have trouble reading the PDF version? > > -- Matt Mahoney, [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > ------------------------------------------- > agi > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ > Modify Your Subscription: > https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > -- Ben Goertzel, PhD CEO, Novamente LLC and Biomind LLC Director of Research, SIAI [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Nothing will ever be attempted if all possible objections must be first overcome " - Dr Samuel Johnson ------------------------------------------- agi Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=117534816-b15a34 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
