On Sun, 2002-02-24 at 11:12, Jason van Zyl wrote: > On Sun, 2002-02-24 at 10:51, John Morrison wrote: > > I *know* that it would be the best way forwards - but think about > > the inertia that Sam had to over come to get GUMP accepted (and > > I don't think all have done yet) in Jakarta/Apache projects.
I apologize. Let me make some corrections as I've been up all night and there are more typos in this message then all the ones I've made this week (which is a lot). I've just corrected inline. > This is the whole problem I see with Gump in that it is currently highly > centralized and not easy for people to participate because it requires > the maintenance of a descriptor that really has nothing to do with > day-to-day development. If you make a project descriptor part of > day-to-day development then participating in Gump builds is a no brainer. > This is the approach I've taken with Maven, if you use Maven for your > project then participation in Gump builds will be automated and correct. > > If your project doesn't want to use Maven (or something like it) then > you get to maintain your Gump descriptor by hand and changes in > dependencies or build system usually results in a project failing to build until Sam > fixes it manually. > > I don't actually care if anyone uses Maven, I made it to help manage > Turbine projects and Tambora, the project I deal with on a daily basis. > But I plan to move all the Turbine projects over to using Maven and > hopefully this will make managing turbine easier and provide up-to-date > correctness for Gump. > > > Also - how do you see the mechanism for *adding* projects to the > > GUMP build? > > If a project uses Maven then I will use BCEL and a JavaCC-based Java > parser to find all the dependencies and provide CLI and GUI tools for > adding to the Maven descriptor. I intend for it to be automated for the > most part. > > > Should we only add the projects which Apache projects > > rely on or should it be open to everyone who asks? > > I don't think so. I'm planning on making it easy to use Maven, and if > someone uses it then they can very easily participate in Gump builds. > > > If it's > > everyone have you considered the time it would take to cvs update, > > rsync and build? Not to mention the harddrive requirements... > > Yes, I've considered it. I don't believe the info provided from building > from HEAD on a daily > basis is particularly useful for a project. I believe that as a project > gains greater control over its domain and its developers have a greater > comprehension overall that they will have time to participate in things > like Gump. For me Maven is first and foremost a tool of pragmatic > value and I'm not immediately concerned with the social experiment > aspect which is Sam's imperative. I feel cooperation between projects > will happen as a natural side-effect when the project itself is easier to manage. > > So I think building against HEAD is something that could happen on a > weekly basis. Projects could be notified of an impending build, the > descriptor could be transfered to the build machine and then the build > happens. This would obviously need some work but I call it a reactor and > a reactor can have any number of participants. I'm setting on up for > Tambora so we can have a reactor that deals with the projects that are > of immediate concern to me but the same process, I believe, would work > for larger builds. But I feel that the impetus must come from the > projects and it has to be easy to participate which is what I'm trying > to do with Maven. > > > I don't see this happening. Prove me wrong - I'd love to see > > GUMP used everywhere (I use it mainly internally). > > I see it happening mainly because I see it as requiring very minimal > effort eventually. I hope to use the Turbine projects as an example of > how easy it will be to participate and at the same time alleviate Sam of > the burden of having to deal with our turbine descriptors which are > often a great source of irritation. > > > J. > > > > <snip/> > > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > -- > jvz. > > Jason van Zyl > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://tambora.zenplex.org > > > -- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -- jvz. Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://tambora.zenplex.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
