I concur with Joe's observations with one addition. The high mounting point of the inboard lights on the GTV makes it a nonsensical spot to mount fogs. Fog lights should be mounted as low as is practical (below the bumper, preferably) to cut through the fog. High mounting produces glare and makes them virtually useless.
Peace, Ben Received: by 10.231.42.150 with SMTP id s22mr5356623ibe.22.1256960150861; Fri, 30 Oct 2009 20:35:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.16.75 with SMTP id n11cs218760iba; Fri, 30 Oct 2009 20:35:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from majordomo by krusty-motorsports.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1N44kf-0004ht-Se for [email protected]; Sat, 31 Oct 2009 03:35:41 +0000 Received: from krusty-motorsports.com (krusty-motorsports.com [192.94.170.8]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id 41si8536961iwn.78.2009.10.30.20.35.50; Fri, 30 Oct 2009 20:35:50 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: <[email protected]> Reply-To: "Joe Elliott" <[email protected]> From: "Joe Elliott" <[email protected]> Sender: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> References: <[email protected]> In-Reply-To: <[email protected]> Subject: [alfa] Re: Headlights Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 22:35:53 -0500 Message-ID: <p0624080dc7115817c...@[192.168.10.4]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcpZ2z43sF1lmuGCSDybzdApCsT1QA== X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.44,657,1249272000"; d="scan'208";a="703056118" Daniel Stern is certainly a great source, for both information and product, and I certainly agree with his recommendation for a fog light if that's really what you're after. BUT... your GTV isn't supposed to have fog lights in the inboard headlight position. That configuration is an artifact of dumbass USA regulations that not only banned '60s lens technology and '70s bulb technology, but also stipulated that if your outboard high/low headlights were 7" diameter you couldn't have inboard high beams as well. So GTVs came to this country with fog lights mounted there (while Jags and BMWs gave up their 7" outboard lights for 5.75" units so they could retain their inboard high beams). So you should know that what's meant to go there is an H1 high beam headlight (or "driving light," if you prefer that term), also available from Daniel Stern. What makes the most sense for your application obviously depends on the weather and roads that you drive in/on, obviously, but I'm of the opinion that with good low beam headlights (which you already have, unless you bought Hella's "Vision Plus" pseudo-Euro-spec headlight which Mr. Stern appropriately refers to as "Vision Minus"), fog lights are largely unnecessary in all but the worst fog. I also feel compelled to point out that while aircraft landing lights may be a suitable analog for an automotive driving light (I'd say "poor man's driving light," but they ain't cheap), aircraft *taxi* lights would be the appropriate substitute for an automotive fog light. And someone else asked about lights for a GTV-6 and Spider. Daniel Stern is the short answer, but I'd like to futher encourage you to spend the big bucks on the complex (rather than parabolic) reflector lights for the GTV-6. (Although I don't see the complex reflector high beam on his products page anymore and am suddenly worried that I may have missed my chance to buy a set--while the big improvement is to be had with the low beams, I'd hate to think the complete set is no longer available.) While the 1970s technology parabolic reflector H4 Euro-spec headlights (which I'm happy with on all of my cars) are a vast improvement over USA-spec sealed beams stuck in the 1950s, those $111 lights at the top of Stern's products page will bring genuinely-1990s lighting to your GTV-6, which seems like a worthwhile investment to me, although I have yet to try them firsthand. (My GTV-6 is terminally rusty, otherwise I'd spend the $444 there in a heartbeat, and I wanted convex lenses for purely asthetic reasons on my Fiat Dino, so it didn't get these lovely lights either--but rest assured that if I'm foolish enough to buy the Maserati Khamsin that's available locally I'll be buying a set of these headlights just as soon as I put Euro bumpers and taillights on it...) For the Spider there are additional options besides what Stern is offering. If you're into the flat-lens look (which I'm not, at least not on a Spider), Hella makes a flat-lens 7" H4 high/low light which is functionally identical to Stern's Cibie product. I've also seen a 7" unit that combines a projector beam lowbeam and halogen highbeam behind one 7" lens, but I have no idea who makes it, who sells it, or if it's any good (but if designed properly it could easily feature the same 1990s-quality lighting that I was getting so excited about for the GTV-6 application a few sentences ago). And if anyone is still reading I'll go ahead and mention that I have observed slight differences in performance between Cibie's convex-lens parabolic reflector 5.75" lights and Hella's flat-lens parabolic reflector lights, which may be relevant if the complex reflector lights are too pricey for you (or you're uncomfortable with the slight wiring modification they require). Cibie's convex-lens highbeam projects further down the road (think "pencil beam" driving light, but not that extreme), wheras Hella's flat-lens highbeam casts a wider beam that lights up more off to the side of the road (e.g. cervine jaywalkers). I don't have any firsthand experience with Cibie's flat-lens parabolic reflector headlights, so I can't say whether they'd be more like the convex Cibies or the flat Hellas. But hopefully you don't care because I already convinced you to splurge on the superior complex reflector lights in my previous paragraph, right? -Joe At 11:53 AM +0000 10/30/09, alfa-digest wrote: >Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2009 07:52:58 -0400 >From: Bruce giller <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [alfa] Fog lamps for GTV > >I conversed with Daniel Stern as to which lamp I should get for my GTV. My >priorities were: 1. performance, 2 price, 3. appearance. > >Here is his suggestion: > >************************** >I'm going to recommend a Hella BiFocus selective-yellow replaceable-bulb H1 >beam unit for this application. It's got a good, sharp cutoff and nice wide >beam for use in bad weather, with excellent glare control so you can use >them in traffic, but also has enough distance punch along the right side of >the road that if things get really soupy you can safely and effectively use >them as primary headlamps. They have a flat lens face so they'll look good >with your flat-lens Hella main headlamps, and they contain a "city light" >(European parking lamp). They're $109/ea. >*************************** > >IAP has fog lamps listed for $12 each - obviously sealed lo-beams, nothing >fancy. I have IAP's Hella Euro headlights for my hi/lo units. I found the >BiFocus units at another on-line racing store for $95/each. > >I looked at aircraft landing lights and there sure are many types to select >from.... and they aren't cheap either. > >Bruce > >On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 12:15 PM, Russell Neely <[email protected]> wrote: > >> How about air craft landing lights? They are not fog lights, but they >> do light up the night. >> >> Ciao, >> Russ Neely >> >> >> >> >> --- On *Wed, 10/28/09, Bruce giller <[email protected]>* wrote: >> >> >> From: Bruce giller <[email protected]> >> Subject: [alfa] Fog lamps for GTV >> To: "Alfa Digest" <[email protected]> >> Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 10:52 AM >> >> One of my GTV's fog lamps is kaput since a rock has broken the lens and the >> filament burned out. I believe that they are 5.75" round units. IAP sells >> fog lamps for the GTV but I'm looking for a more modern design: a halogen >> lamp with a fog-lamp-designed lens. Daniel Stern's Lighting page as a good >> writeup on fog lamps: >> http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/lights/fog_lamps/fog_lamps.html . >> >> Anyone know where I can get a modern 5.75" round fog lamp that will fit my >> GTV ? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Bruce >> >> '73 GTV -- to be removed from alfa, see http://www.digest.net/bin/digest-subs.cgi or email "unsubscribe alfa" to [email protected] -- to be removed from alfa, see http://www.digest.net/bin/digest-subs.cgi or email "unsubscribe alfa" to [email protected]
