Hi, Richard:
Thank for your valuable review, you have a good understand to this draft.
Please see my reply inline below.

Regards!
-Qin

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Y. 
Richard Yang
Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 10:01 AM
To: Qin Wu
Cc: [email protected]; Xialiang (C)
Subject: Re: [alto] FW: I-D Action: draft-wu-alto-json-te-00.txt

Hi Qin,

Thanks for the work on TE performance metrics. Here are some quick comments:

- It is not fully clear to me if you want to consider linkdelay, linkjitter, 
... as new Cost Metrics also or they will be only constraints of the 
"routingcost" Cost Metric. Does it make sense to consider them as Cost Metrics?

[Qin]:You raised a very good question. We can either put performance metrics 
like link delay, link jitter as constraints of the "routing cost" with few 
impact on ALTO base protocol or consider them as new cost metrics with more 
extension to ALTO base protocol.
My current take is the benefit of coupling link delay, link jitter with 
"routing cost" is to provide finer granularity for "routing cost" since routing 
cost can be calculated based on constraints likelink delay, link jitter as 
input.

Decoupling link delay, link jitter from 'routing cost' lost such benefit.

- If so, a feedback is that ALTO Cost Metric need to follow the RFC 6390:

[Qin]: Agree, however we are not new cost metric in the current draft, 
currently we consider link delay as constraint of 'routingcost'.


6390 Guidelines for Considering New Performance Metric Development. A.
     Clark, B. Claise. October 2011. (Format: TXT=49930 bytes) (Also
     BCP0170) (Status: BEST CURRENT PRACTICE)

In particular, Sec. 5.4 of RFC 6390 specifies a template for specifying 
additional performance metrics (Cost Metrics). I believe that we will follow 
the template. As an example, the template specifies Units of Measurement (item 
iv) which are missing in the draft. How about we follow the template?

[Qin]: If you believe we should define new Cost metric, I think we should 
follow RFC6390 template.
However we are not supposed to define new metrics in this draft rather than 
reference the metrics that have already been defined in 
draft-ietf-ospf-te-metric-extensions
Or draft-ietf-isis-te-metric-extensions.

Another clarification to your question, is actually we have already specified 
measurement unit for each performance metric even though they are existing 
metrics defined somewhere else, see 'linkdelay' example in the draft:
"
Value type:  A single number value containing an integer component that
               may be prefixed with an optional minus sign, which may
               be followed by a fraction part and/or an exponent part.
"

- In your example json:



   "data": {

            "cost type": {

               "cost-mode": "numerical",

               "cost-metric":"routingcost"},

            "constraints" : {"linkdelay"},

            "endpoints": {

                    "srcs": [ "ipv4:192.0.2.2" ],

                    "dsts": [

                    "ipv4:192.0.2.89",

                    "ipv4:198.51.100.34",

                    "ipv4:203.0.113.45"

                             ]

            }

// YRY: missing <- "}" ?



[Qin]: Good catch, thanks.



    "map": {

            "ipv4:192.0.2.2": {

            "ipv4:192.0.2.89": 0.0[linkdelay eq 0.0],

            "ipv4:198.51.100.34": 15.0[linkdelay eq 3.0],

            "ipv4:203.0.113.45": 1.0[linkdelay eq 12.0],

                  }

              }

Is the example query or response? I understand that they are response, but I 
feel that it can be helpful to start with specifying the input of filtering.

[Qin]:Correct, agree.

Let's see if my understanding of your input is correct. The current spec is:


object {

     CostType   cost-type;

     [JSONString constraints<0..*>;]

     [PIDFilter  pids;]

} ReqFilteredCostMap;



object {

     PIDName srcs<0..*>;

     PIDName dsts<0..*>;

} PIDFilter;

You appear to extend the request format to be:

object {

     CostType   cost-type;

     [JSONString constraints<0..*>;]

     [Endpoints endpoints;]  // YRY: new?



     [PIDFilter  pids;]

} ReqFilteredCostMap;
I feel that you are extending the syntax of "constraints" (see top of page 49 
of -17). Will it be helpful to define the grammar first?

[Qin]: Just to clarify, we follow the existing grammar defined in the section 
10.4.1.3 of ALTO base protocol draft:
"
10.4.1.3<http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-alto-protocol-17#section-10.4.1.3>.
  Accept Input Parameters

   An ALTO Client supplies the endpoint cost parameters through a media
   type "application/alto-endpointcostparams+json", with an HTTP POST
   entity body of a JSON Object of type ReqEndpointCostMap:


   object {
     CostType          cost-type;
     [JSONString       constraints<0..*>;]
     EndpointFilter    endpoints;
   } ReqEndpointCostMap;

   object {
     [TypedEndpointAddr srcs<0..*>;]
     [TypedEndpointAddr dsts<0..*>;]
   } EndpointFilter;


"
Rather than the grammar you are referring to, in this case, do you believe we 
should define new grammar?

- Regarding response, I read that you want the response to include the values 
of multiple attributes. For example, from your example, you are trying to say 
that:

from "ipv4:192.0.2.2" to "ipv4:198.51.100.34"

has routing cost 15 and delay 3. Is this correct?

[Qin]: Correct

There are discussions on extending the map to report multiple attributes., and 
personally, I will find the following format easier to read (more symmetric):

ipv4:198.51.100.34": ["routingcost": 15.0, "linkdelay":3.0],


[Qin]:Good point, . We can make this more clear in the next version, thank for 
your proposed change.


Please let me know if I understand you correctly.

Thanks!

Richard
On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 3:48 AM, Qin Wu 
<[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Hi,folks:
Here is the initial draft (v-00)to discuss Json format representation
for TE performance metrics advertised by OSPF in the ALTO
information resource Directory.
The URL link is available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-wu-alto-json-te-00
Your comments and feedback are welcome!

Regards!
-Qin
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> 
[mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On 
Behalf Of [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2013 3:21 PM
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: I-D Action: draft-wu-alto-json-te-00.txt

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.


        Title           : JSON Format Extensions for Traffic Engineering (TE) 
performance metrics in the ALTO Information Resource Directory
        Author(s)       : Qin Wu
                          Liang Xia
        Filename        : draft-wu-alto-json-te-00.txt
        Pages           : 16
        Date            : 2013-07-08

Abstract:
   The base ALTO specification defines two properties for cost metric
   attribute in the Cost MAP, including 'hopcount' and 'routingcost'.
   This specification adds five new properties and one new parameter for
   Traffic Engineering(TE) performance related constraint attribute
   associated with cost metric attribute 'routingcost' in the ALTO
   Information Resource Directory: Link Delay, Delay Variation, Packet
   Loss, Residual Bandwidth, Available Bandwidth,linkstate.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-wu-alto-json-te

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-wu-alto-json-te-00


Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

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