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Graham,,
that was a good read,,,for me,,someone with his head blown apart but i know
nothing of excel,
P
Sorry, I should have checked that I had replied privately about this
AFL
The code was prepared for customers
--
Cheers
Graham
AB-Write >< Professional AFL Writing
Service
Yes, I write AFL code to your requirements
http://www.aflwriting.com
On 17/10/06, brian.z123 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]com.au>
wrote:
Hello Jlami11,
The
virtues of AB are often extolled in this forum (along with the
vices) but
I don't think I have seen a post that even goes close to
doing it
justice.
Tomasz is too modest to list all the good points in one place
himself, although God knows that after 100k posts it is well
overdue.
Here is my attempt that will have to suffice until
bettered.
*******************************************************************
Conclusion:
The bad news is that it takes a lot of patience to master
AmiBroker,
especially for those who are not seasoned
traders/programmers.
The good new is that it is worth the
effort.
If there is a better program out there Tomasz would have known
about
it a long time ago ;-)
(If you are in a hurry skip to list
at the bottom of the
post).
*******************************************************************
An
interesting question.
As a relatively new Ami user I can empathise with
you.
Keep in mind that there is no *holy grail* of software or
anything
else in trading.
Also my only intention is to offer help to
you and give credit to
AmiBroker where it is due.
What you are
really asking is; "Will AmiBroker be worth the time I
will have to put
in to learn it, will I be capable of learning it
and what will I be able
to do with it when I am competent?",
(that is like looking for your
glasses!).
Ultimately you are the only one who can answer that.
You need to clarify how serious you are about trading and
clearly
state your trading objectives to yourself first.
I am
continually amazed by the number of people who come into this
forum and
who, presumably, want to be winning traders, but obviously
do not have a
winning attitude (I am not suggesting that is you. I
am simply providing
some context to my comments).
If that is the case they can not blame the
software for their
eventual and inevitable failure.
My
experiences may provide some guideance for you.
I am a
non-programmer, non-mathematician and a self-taught
computer
layperson.
I do not have a tertiary education.
I am
probably of above average intelligence but I don't know exactly
where I
am on that line and I have no interest in finding out.
Fortunately I do
have abilities and talents of some kind that get me
by, althoguh I am not
sure exactly what they are either.
Four years ago I had zero
experience in investment of any kind when
I set myself very high
investment goals.
I will rephrase the last part; I knew specifically what
I wanted to
achieve as an investor (if the format would allow it I would
bold or
underline specifically, as in, the % return I am going to get and
the hours per week I am going to get it in).
After the intitial
learning phase I also quickly identified what
investment styles I
*believed* in and which ones suited my personal
characterstics and
objectives e.g. I don't want to spend hours
reading company reports,
financials etc so I went away from that
type of trading.
Once again I
would underline *belief* and *personal characteristics*.
In
short, when I bought AB I knew why I was buying it.
At that stage I had
already settled on *trading* as my chosen
primary investment vehicle and
I also had a definite trading style.
I wanted to use AB as the tool to
develop and implement that on a
wider scale.
I am continually
improving and growing so I never say never as far
as trading goes but so
far nothing I have learnt in AmiWorld has
changed my view on trading; it
has simply confirmed and enhanced it.
I didn't know exactly what I
was getting with AB but I did exchange
a couple of emails with support
in which I discussed the capability
of AB in the key areas of my
interest.
My questions were somewhat naive, and Tomasz probably scratched
his
head a little, but he gave me a professional reply.
Specifically
I enquired about customising my own stops and one or
two other similar
questions, as I do not trade in anything I don't
understand.
If I can
code it myself I definitely understand it.
I had also found that what
passes as folklore in common investment
culture more often than not does
not stand up to analysis, so I
prefer to go my own way; no *canned*
anything for me.
My conclusion was that on the balance of probability
AB would do the
job. I also formed a favourable impression of the
CEO/developer i.e.
he was obviously no dummy with an exceptional empathy
for his users
and that is an important thing when buying and using
trading
software.
You have to have confidence.
(That wasn't too bad
an assessment based on two short emails was it?
Time has proven that to
be spot on).
Like all products, only long term ownership will provide
a complete
answer to buyer satisfaction, so I went ahead and
purchased.
I am quite used to spending money on dead leads etc; that is
normal
business practise and I consider it to be a part of
development
costs.
I didn't hesitate to spend USD$199 on Ami.
Like
any business, there was no guarentee that cost would ever be
recouped.
That is not to mention the intellectual capital invested
e.g. my first 2
trading years and $15000 were purely speculative
ventures, until I
reached a point where I was able to prove to
myself that, compared to the
majority, I was quite good at it.
For the record my trading
disposition is objective, mechanical
system, TA based, but I do keep an
open mind and will snap up
anything that works.
I consider myself to
be a developing trader.
It is not something that can be mastered in a few
hundred or even a
few thousand hours; not from my background anyway.
I could write a book on the subject, and I might one day, but to
cut
to the chase.
I have used a lot of other market programs but
my experience is
lightweight compared to some in this group.
I will
benchmark my comments against the last program I used, which
was one of
the majors.
I was very happy with it in every respect until after 1000's
of
hours of commitment to learning it, I found it couldn't actually
do
what I really needed it to.
The backtester didn't work, at least
not the way I expected it too,
and at that time my expectations were not
as high as they are now.
I managed to jig around that problem by
using the programs explorer
as a psuedo-backtester and exporting the
results to Xcel for
analysis.
I was proud of myself, as a
non-programmer, for achieving that.
I set up four older computers with a
KVM switch as my test-bank and
reeled off a few thousand hours of
backtesting until I simply came
to the end of the line, fullstop.
Why
stuff around with homemade backtesters when there are
professionals
writing and maintaining them for a living?
Hence AmiBroker, which
incidentally was recommended to me by the
developer of a quite well known
money management program.
It was very hard to have to start all over
again in a new program,
especially after being able to use the old one
fluently.
The first 3 months of Ami were very de-motivating.
I found
it to be a hard program to learn and I had to grit my teeth
more than a
few times.
One of the reasons it is hard to learn is that it has a lot
more
depth and breadth than my previous program.
That automatically
demands more learning time.
It also has a different business model to
what most of us have come
to expect e.g the manual in AB is not a
textbook that is posted in
the mail nor is it merely the help
files.
The *manual* in Ami is dynamic and offers a lot more than help
files
but it is also less structured.
It also leaves out a few bits
and pieces here and there that a lot
of beginners would expect to
find.
I am comfortable with that but some people aren't.
It is not a
good system for beginners but it is a great system for
seasoned
performers.
Why begrudge them that; they are entitled to their place in
the
world?
I guess in a way, that makes Ami a boutique program,
although I am
sure Tomasz will correct me if that is wrong.
My
attitude is; "if you can't beat them join them".
I am playing catch-up at
a furious rate.
My trading objectives are very high.
I bought
AB in the belief that it was the program most likely to
enable me to
meet those objectives.
I have had the program approx 6 months and have
spent a lot of hours
per week on it.
I don't have the definitive
answer but so far AB has not
disappointed.
The ultimate responsibility
is not on Tomasz's shoulders, it is on
mine.
Initially Tomasz
answered my *buying* questions and provided a free
trial.
It was my
decision to buy.
Let the buyer beware.
I am continually
learning and improving so the things I want to do
in the future may well
be different from my current expectations but
I am confident Ami will
accommodate my growth.
I have said that if I don't achieve my trading
goals with Ami there
will not be another program, which is my way of
saying that Ami is
good enough if I am good enough.
I do have a cut
off point and I will retire my trading career if I
retire Ami.
I
won't look back and list the negatives of other programs.
I will not list
the negatives of AmiBroker either (I am into
positivity) although I will
say it is not
perfect.
******************************************************************
My
list of AB positives (not in any particular order):
1.
price
2. *fully* customiseable
3. distant horizon (most traders will
never exceed its ability.
Those who do exceed AB's limits
don't mind sharing their
knowledge and Tomasz doesn't like coming second
so that should tell
you something).
4. transparent and
controllable
5. honest dialogue
6. ethical company
7. allows use
with a wide range of data providers
8. cheap and free data options for
those who need that
9. trading orientated program (truly for traders by
traders)
10. trading friendships
11. trading mentorships
12.
active forum with a sprinkling of diverse specialists
13. quick responses
to program 'bugs'
14. 24-48 hour support
15. rapid pace of
development
16. responsive to suggestions
17. extensive support
material albeit hard to find at first
18. open architecture
19.
personal contact with CEO
20. CEO accepts and answers criticism in
public
21. trading specific programming language (you don't need to learn
C++ etc just learn AFL. If that is your first language it will be
a
challenge but I am doing it. I only read half a dummies
book,
quarter of an online manual on scripting and a bit of Wikipedia
here
and there and away I went. My prior formula language and backtesting
experience does help though).
22. the last market software program I
will ever have to master
23. challenging
24. offers trading
opportunities I hadn't thought of before
25. good rapport with and
respect for the developer
26. provides easy access to basic fundamental
data in formulas
27. provides access to unlimited external database
(especially
useful for referencing extensive fundamental
databases)
28. cheap and reliable *industry standard* charting program
for
those who just want that
29. time efficient (there are no
unneccessary frills anywhere in
Amiworld. If anything there are probably
not enough frills depending
on who you ask).
30. mature program (10+
years)
31. extensive library (official and unofficial) of popular
industry
indicators etc
32. licenced to use on more than one
machine
33. speed
34. 64 bit and dual core processors not a future
problem?
35. backward compatibility not a problem?
36. has trading
orientated functions the others do not have?
37. array based processing
which is a very *commonsense* approach
for laypeople. Use is analagous to
Xcel spreadsheet rows except for
more advanced uses where programming
procedures like looping come
into play (when you can see your code
output being written into Xcel
rows in your minds eye you are nearly
there).
I have spent a lot of time in Xcel prior to AB so that helps me
to
step into AFL. If you are good with Xcel functions you will
definitely be good with AFL.
38. industry standard *canned scans* are
easily achievable with
simple code
39. It is a very pragmatic program
e.g I have 5-10 tasks on my
advanced list that are industry wide trader
breakers. I have already
cracked two or three of those in Ami without
even getting out of
second gear and I am optimistic about the rest (Null
data handling,
custom indexes and survivor bias are the first three
demons to bite
the dust).
40. readily perform trainging examples and
problem solve using
explorer.
41. ASCII import for the data
masochists
In short it does exactly what the publicity blurb on the
homepage
says it will do, and more!
There are probably
additional postives but a mint tea and a bowl of
muesli is
calling.
BrianB2. =8-)
P.S Tomasz, this doesn't provide you
future immunity from my
withering critiques.
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED]ps.com,
"jlami11" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I
just wanted to know how Amibroker compares to other software.
>
> In particular I heard tradingblox was pretty good and could
do
alot,
> while requiring less programming. Or would programming
required be
the
> same if more advanced functions were needed e.g.
dynamic pos
sizing,
> dynamic risk control etc etc.
>
>
Has anyone used tradingblox? and if Amibroker and Tradingblox
were
the
> same price, which one would you prefer?
>
>
Lastly is Amibroker generally superior to other software? I ask
this
> as I come from a non-programming background and would not
be easy
for
> me to adapt to diff. software in
future.
>
> Thanks in advance any help is
appreciated.
>
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