I have not checked V/OI but would not be surprised if leveraged vehicles (e.g., QID, etc.) have not eaten into the options. They certainly have for me.
Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: bilbo0211 To: [email protected] Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 10:31 AM Subject: [amibroker] Re: Anyone actually making money? >>What ever happened to day traders and short term traders trading the OEX options or futures contract? This was the premire indices to trade. It seems you could make a small fortune day trading this alone.<< QQQQ options are replacing OEX options as the option instrument of choice for day trading. OEX option volume peaked in the 1980's, today it is less than 15% of its peak value and declining. Open interest is less than 1/5 of its peak value. QQQQ option volume and open interest are much larger than that of OEX options and rising. Advantages of QQQQ options over OEX options: Narrower spreads, near the money QQQQ options rarely have a Bid/Ask spread > 0.01 -> better fills and larger profits. More liquid -> faster fills and less market manipulation. Larger % moves -> use closer to the money strikes to get comparable leverage. >>Why are traders interested in finding a stock that might make a significant move when indices maybe a less volatile way to trade?<< Greater volatility means greater profit potential. If you swing trade, there are more potential trading opportunities with stocks than with indices because there are many more of them. Bill --- In [email protected], "Ernie Newman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > What ever happened to day traders and short term traders trading the > OEX options or futures contract? This was the premire indices to > trade. It seems you could make a small fortune day trading this alone. > Why are traders interested in finding a stock that might make a > significant move when indices maybe a less volatile way to trade? > Just my opinion. > Ernie > > --- In [email protected], "Paul Ho" <paul.tsho@> wrote: > > > > Louis > > A surgeon trained for more than a decade before his first > operation. > > An Engineer requires at least one decade of training including > > university and practical training on the job before he can sign his > > name on a buiding permit. Everything takes time to master, trading > > is no different. Universities and colleges divides their teachings > > into different courses at different degree of difficulties because > > they know too much knowledge, too much disorganised knowledge is > > bewildering and confusing to the learner. This is also true for > you. > > you'll have to organise the way you learn. Learn one area, > > one timeframe, one technique, one style and one setup until you > > master it before you move on to the next. It dosesn't seem you are > > struck with that technique for the rest of your life. It just mean > > you'll have to learn how to walk before you run. > > There are many styles, and techniques, setups out there. Decide on > > one and stick with it until you understand it, know it, proficient > at > > applying it before you move on. Amibroker forum is a smorgesboard > of > > discussions and ideas, but it can become a distraction if you are > not > > disciplined enough, jumping from one idea to the next, without > giving > > sufficient time to let it "get" to you. > > You will no doubt make your own mind up. You will make a decision > on > > what you do based on your personality, trading styles, and perhaps > > you circumstances. Some time later, you may revisit your decisions > > again, but fundamentally your future will be pretty much guided by > > the decisions you make today. If you understand that, then you will > > also understand that you, and you alone are the cause of your own > > fortune. There are plenty of people who fail and succeed in each > > style. Whether that is Support and Resistance, or intrdays system > > based auto-trading, and how much concentration, dedication and > > tenanicity you are going to give to honour your decision, it is all > > up to you. > > --- In [email protected], "Louis P." <rockprog80@> wrote: > > > > > > Thank you all for your responses. What can I say, except that > > there is lot > > > of stuff to think about here! > > > > > > From what I have read, the most important part to actually make > > money from > > > all this is Money Management. That's where I am so weak; I tried > > to deal > > > with low-liquidity stocks precisely because I wanted to get a > > leverage, but > > > I don't see how I can do this on high liquidity stock without > > having to use > > > all my money power (to get on the margin). > > > > > > There is a big part on charts, indicators, etc. in the manual, > but > > maybe it > > > would be nice to have more explanation about all to use money > > management > > > tools. Or maybe I missed the explanations. > > > > > > What's my goal? 30-40% a year is what I'd like to achieve. I > was > > able to > > > build a system using low-liquidity stocks to build that, but that > > was before > > > I realized that real-time trading has a limit of 500 "live" > > tickers. I > > > tried to find a way around that problem, but well, it didn't work. > > > > > > To Brian: yes I have read the messages about this. I read about > > 75% of > > > everything that is written on this board. But it didn't help me > > enough... > > > yet. I might have to rethink how I do things. I was (and still > > am) just > > > curious to see how other people were dealing with this; is it > > possible to > > > make a lot of money with this, and if yes, how ("how" is not > asking > > for a > > > particular code, but more general ideas). Right now I am > working > > on high > > > liquidity stock, but I feel like this might also be a wrong idea. > > > > > > To you people who make a lot of money using automated trading > code > > generated > > > with AB, on what kind of markets do you do it? Stocks? > Futures? > > Big caps, > > > small caps? > > > > > > I've read people who say a big problem is sticking to the system. > > > Personnally I think this will be the easiest part for me; when > the > > system > > > will be ready I will follow it blindly. The problem to me is how > > to get > > > there. 7 months might seem like not a lot of time, but I worked > > numerous > > > hours on this in that timeframe and had brilliant ideas that just > > wouldn't > > > do the trick. That's why I am confused right now and I was > actually > > > wondering if it was possible to make money out of this. > > > > > > Thanks a for your interesting responses! > > > > > > Louis > > > > > > > > > > > > 2008/7/31 sidhartha70 <sidhartha70@> > > > > > > > Ohh Paul... I agree about knowing yourself as I said in my > > answer to > > > > Brian. But that's a given surely...?? You only learn that from > > years > > > > of trading and observing yourself... you can of course become > > informed > > > > on the subject of yourself... there's plenty of literature on > > it... > > > > Mark Douglas obviously. > > > > > > > > But I stand by what I said... you can become a great trader by > > really > > > > understanding trendlines, support & resistance in it's many > forms > > and > > > > studying price & volume action... > > > > > > > > I know it... because I've seen it... and I've done it. > > > > > > > > You have your techniques Paul... and good luck to you. Great if > > they > > > > work for you. For me, this is what has worked for me... > > > > > > > > Henrik thanks for your response. Good to see others agree. > > > > > > > > Paul, might I suggest you get out more and make some more human > > > > connections... you'd probably find you'd be happier, less > angry, > > less > > > > arrogant, less superior and might even enjoy some of this money > > you > > > > make trading... > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected] <amibroker% > > 40yahoogroups.com>, "Paul Ho" > > > > <paul.tsho@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I'm still waiting for your to say something sensible, that's > of > > value, > > > > > > rather than just dig everyone out...??? > > > > > > > > > > LOL, I just told you. YOu cant become a good trader until you > > know > > > > > yourself, really know yourself. Knowing how to draw a few > lines > > makes > > > > > you a TA guy, not a trader. understanding the market makes > you a > > > > > market analyst. Even know how to develop a system doesnt make > > you a > > > > > trader either, you are merely a system developer. When you > > master > > > > > yourself, you are on your way to become a real trader. > > > > > Just because you've been involved in trading for years, > seeing > > others > > > > > making millions, no more makes your a trader than me an > > olympian just > > > > > because I've been watching olypmics for the last 45 years. > > > > > You might think I'm slagging you off, but in years to come, > you > > will > > > > > find out for yourself whats true. > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected] <amibroker% > 40yahoogroups.com>, > > > > "sidhartha70" <sidhartha70@> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Paul, > > > > > > > > > > > > I programme too... nothing wrong with programming and > making > > your > > > > > life > > > > > > easier. And nothing wrong with asking for someone to 'throw > > you a > > > > > > bone' in that goal... I'm new to AFL. So what?? > > > > > > > > > > > > I've been involved in trading for many years... market > > making, index > > > > > > arbitrage, statistical arbitrage, long/short prop etc.. > many > > years. > > > > > > And some of the best money makers I've ever seen have been > > traders, > > > > > > not system traders, who genuinely have a great read of the > > market > > > > > > based off tape reading skills... they have achieved returns, > > > > > > consistently, that systems traders can only dream of... > > > > > > > > > > > > I've traded both... systems and otherwise... you can > > programme all > > > > > the > > > > > > most complicated indictaors you like... they are all based > on > > the > > > > > same > > > > > > things tape reading is... which is price & volume action... > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm still waiting for your to say something sensible, > that's > > of > > > > > value, > > > > > > rather than just dig everyone out...??? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected] <amibroker% > > 40yahoogroups.com>, "Paul > > > > Ho" <paul.tsho@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > learn everything you can > > > > > > > about trendlines, support & resistance and the old tape > > reading > > > > > skills > > > > > > > and you will be miles ahead of 'system developers' in > terms > > of > > > > > > > actually understanding the markets and becoming a better > > trader. > > > > > > > ....... > > > > > > > So you think understanding a few lines on the chart you > will > > > > > become > > > > > > a better > > > > > > > trader!!! > > > > > > > So you think understanding the market will make you a > better > > > > > trader!!! > > > > > > > So you think you are miles ahead just because you know > how > > to > > > > > draw a > > > > > > lines > > > > > > > rather than a system trader who write a few hundred lines > of > > > > > codes. > > > > > > > NONE OF THE ABOVE WILL MAKE YOU A GOOD TRADER > > > > > > > YOU WILL ONLY BECOME A GOOD TRADER IF YOU KNOW YOUSELF. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'LL KEEP THIS IN A SAFE PLACE AND USE IT AS A REPLY WHEN > > YOU ASK > > > > > > SOMEONE TO > > > > > > > THROW YOU A BONE. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: [email protected] <amibroker% > > 40yahoogroups.com> > > > > > [mailto:[email protected] <amibroker% > 40yahoogroups.com>] > > > > > > > On Behalf Of sidhartha70 > > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, 31 July 2008 10:47 PM > > > > > > > To: [email protected] <amibroker% > 40yahoogroups.com> > > > > > > > Subject: [amibroker] Re: Anyone actually making money? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Louis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here's my tip... worth it's weight in gold. I've been > doing > > > > > this for > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > long time... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop looking for the holy grail system... learn everything > > > > > you can > > > > > > > about trendlines, support & resistance and the old tape > > > > > reading > > > > > > > skills > > > > > > > and you will be miles ahead of 'system developers' in > terms > > of > > > > > > > actually understanding the markets and becoming a better > > > > > trader. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Too many people spend far too much time trying to develop > > > > > a 'system' > > > > > > > rather than becoming a better trader. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected] <amibroker% > > 40yahoogroups.com> > > > > > > > <mailto:amibroker%40yahoogroups.com <amibroker% > > 2540yahoogroups.com>> > > > > , "Louis P." <rockprog80@> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I was only wondering... Anyone actually making money or > > > > > making a > > > > > > > living > > > > > > > > with AB and trading? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've been working on ideas and plans for over 7 months > now > > > > > and > > > > > > > didn't find > > > > > > > > anything convincing yet. I've been searching daily data, > > > > > then > > > > > > > hourly, > > > > > > > > 15-minute and now I am into 1-minute data and nothing > > seems > > > > > > > satisfying. > > > > > > > > Been searching RSI, MFI, ADX, MA, HHV, LLV... nothing > > seems > > > > > to > > > > > > > work. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So... Anyone is making consistent money with this, and > if > > > > > so, at > > > > > > > which > > > > > > > > timeframe and how do you do it? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm beginning to think about switching to tick > database; > > it > > > > > seems > > > > > > > even > > > > > > > > 1-minute is too slow for intraday trading. Anyone making > > > > > money > > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > 1-minute? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Louis > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Please note that this group is for discussion between users only. To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check DEVLOG: http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/ For other support material please check also: http://www.amibroker.com/support.html Yahoo! Groups Links No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.10/1585 - Release Date: 8/1/2008 6:39 AM
