No, I didn't take you for a neophyte programmer. I won't apply any adjectives; I'll just note that you're clearly the type of programmer who would question why Mark would wonder, about the data (and thus its implications on requirements, which you finally acknowledge) before attempting to answer you as to how to best transfer it -- and then argue about it.
And the type of programmer who would insist that "ALL data is generic", and dismiss any "philosophical" discussions. And I'm clearly the type of programmer who gives long philosophical answers to people who don't want to hear them -- and then argue about it! I doubt either of us will change. :=) On Jan 13, 8:58 pm, John Lussmyer <[email protected]> wrote: > And that is a very nice philosophical discussion of data in general. > > Still doesn't help any with my original question, and the only implication I > can take from it is that you are assuming I'm a total neophyte programmer > who has no idea what his data is going to be used for, or what it is. > How nice. > > Now, if you actually assume that I'm not an idiot, and actually know what my > own data is, that it is 10 bytes, and I'm asking for ways to transfer it - > then your discussion of data meanings makes even less sense. I wasn't > asking about how to decode my data, how to use it, how to make it work with > another system. I was asking for ways of sharing a block of generic data > between apps. > ALL data is generic. Higher meanings can be applied at either end of it's > travels, which may also have implications about requirements for it's > travel. > It's still data. > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 8:36 PM, Bob Kerns <[email protected]> wrote: > > You weren't paying attention. > > > I was using illustrative examples, chosen mostly for 10-byte -- but > > these issues show up all the time in all kinds of programming, from > > enterprise to consumer utilities, to games. > > > And you didn't say that 10 bytes is just 10 bytes for Android, but not > > for safety systems like cars, airplanes, and medical. But that fits > > nicely with my last point about valuable data vs worthless data. > > > The first pair illustrates that it matters both how quickly and how > > reliably data is delivered. To take an example from an entirely > > different domain -- this is why there is UDP vs TCP. Or consider the > > implications for delays or unreliable delivery if you're downloading a > > program, vs watching a video. > > > The second pair illustrates that the actual byte values to be > > delivered may need to be mapped as part of the delivery. Earth surface > > coordinates, sure, those transfer fine. But often this is not the > > case; often to be useful on the other end, you will have to > > "externalize" those bytes in some manner. To offer another example -- > > raw sensor data may need to be calibrated, referenced, or normalized > > to be useful when transferred from one device to another. This may > > only be possible on the source device. > > > Two different ways that the byte MEANING matters -- both DIRECTLY > > related to how data is delivered. > > > But to quote Mark: "...but you are certainly welcome to your opinion." > > > On Jan 13, 8:18 am, John Lussmyer <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Limiting ourselves to actual real-world scenarios (nobody is going to use > > an > > > Android phone for a Safety Critical control system like your cars > > brakes.), > > > none of those data variations have anything to do with how the data is > > > delivered. > > > > On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 10:47 PM, Bob Kerns <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Oh, easy question! > > > > > 10 bytes of data when it's describing your current brake pedal > > > > pressure is very different than 10 bytes describing the high score to > > > > ultimately post on a web site somewhere when it gets around to > > > > updating. It makes a real difference how quickly and reliably the data > > > > is delivered. > > > > > 10 bytes of data when it is describing a selected record in a large > > > > database is very different from 10 bytes of data which describe > > > > geographic coordinates on the earth's surface. In the latter case, > > > > there's a frame of reference that even a space alien can understand > > > > without a device. In the former, you need not only the database, but > > > > the particular process of selection, which may in turn involve > > > > information known only within the same process. Those 10 bytes may be > > > > meaningless by themselves, taken out of the context in which they have > > > > meaning. > > > > > 10 bytes is 10 bytes -- so long as you don't care about what those > > > > bytes mean or why they exist. That is, if they're worthless. If > > > > they're valuable, on the other hand, it's a whole other story. > > > > > On Jan 12, 6:29 pm, John Lussmyer <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 6:18 PM, Mark Murphy < > > [email protected] > > > > >wrote: > > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 8:35 PM, John Lussmyer < > > [email protected] > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > 10 bytes of data is 10 bytes of data. > > > > > > > Not really, but you are certainly welcome to your opinion. > > > > > > Now this has me curious. What definitions of data would make a > > > > difference? > > > > > -- > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > Groups "Android Developers" group. > > > > To post to this group, send email to > > [email protected] > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > > [email protected]<android-developers%2Bunsubs > > > > [email protected]><android-developers%2Bunsubs > > [email protected]> > > > > For more options, visit this group at > > > >http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > Groups "Android Developers" group. > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]<android-developers%2Bunsubs > > [email protected]> > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Android Developers" group. 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