On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:31 PM 'Felix Fontein' via Ansible Project <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Michael, > > > On 4/7/22 07:40, 'Felix Fontein' via Ansible Project wrote: > > > I really wish you would stop repeating this procedure on every > > > Ansible release. If you want things to actually change, start a > > > proper discussion in the appropriate place > > > (https://github.com/ansible-community/community-topics/). > > > > This topic came up here and is IMHO relevant for normal Ansible > > users. So please don't try to push it away from the users. > > I'm not saying this cannot / should not be discussed here. I'm mainly > saying that 'official' decisions on what happens to the Ansible package > are made by discussions and votes in that repository. So discussing > that here is on thing, but if you really want to change it (and Nico > seems determined), it would be better to (also) start a discussion > there.
I've brought it up before at https://github.com/ansible/ansible/ . Oh, wait! That's not ansible! That's ansible-core! This software split is confusing and means different things to different people. If "ansible" is meant to be both the curated set of ansible collection modules, and ansible-core, bundle ansible collections separately, as the vastly oversized bundle it is, and set "ansible" to pull in that distinctly from ansible-core. The renaming of the "ansible" package to ansible-core and its substitution in the pypi.org package with a tarball which actually installs only ansible_collection has led to a great deal of confusion, at the expense of admins who need laborious explanations of why every pypi.org bundle for ansible is misnamed and does not match it's installation locaiton. > > But if there's an important security fix only in ansible-core Ansible > > users have to be aware to explicitly invoke > > pip install --upgrade ansible-core > > > > to get the updates. So this "implementation detail" is indeed quite > > relevant to Ansible users who want to properly maintain their > > controller. > > That's indeed a problem (especially since `pip install --upgrade > ansible` will not upgrade dependencies when `ansible` is already at the > latest version). One way to (partially) fix this would be to make sure > that Ansible is always released at most a day after ansible-core has > been released. Right now, the delay can be up to two weeks, which is > definitely too long. That is a procedural burden, and an unwelcome one. If "ansible" means both, make it explicitly require both as distinct packages. I'd offer patches to bundle it with the distinct name, but I admit that I find the array of uncommon tools used to create this tarball obscure to tune. It's pretty trivial, but ugly, to take the ansible tarball and tweak it into being an ansible_collections compatible tarball and installable python module instead. > Also I don't mind to update the release template by adding more > information on how ansible-core is 'contained' in ansible. I'm mainly > against completely rewriting it with different language which is more > technically correct, but less helpful and doesn't work together with > the other things (changelog, porting guide, docsite). > > Cheers, > Felix Technical language that lies outright is always confusing and engenders mistrust of its authors. This one, I'm afraid is a fib except in some very strange and underdocumented model where "ansible" is an umbrella term for a suite of software packages, one of which is actually called "ansible" over at pypi.org, and the other of which used to be called "ansible" and is still called "ansible" over at github. It's an unwelcome source of confusion for folks with more productive work to do. Segregating it more carefully will ease the path for people who don't need the very large "ansible_collections" suite at all, and need only the much smaller and leaner ansible-core. That may not fit the agglomerated suite of software model, but it's a lot smaller and a lot more supportable. Isn't destabilizing agglomeration exactly what triggered the split-off of ansible-core and the ansible_collections in the first place? It's difficult to be sure because I can't find a transcript or correspondence history of the decision to split these. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ansible Project" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/ansible-project/CAOCN9rwH8gJwwWkq5PUUhEJXZWRzm9rQJjo24mMBRVGud2%3D%3DvA%40mail.gmail.com.
