Just a reminder that I’d love to get comments on any and all aspects of this 
list by Friday (tomorrow) night.

The AC has a call next Thursday (a week from today) and I would like plenty of 
time to collate them into a summary for discussion.

Regards,

-r

PS:  I am sure it was fairly clear from the context, but I should have 
mentioned last week that the use of first person pronouns such as “I” and “We” 
in these comments reflects the opinions of individual reviewers not the AC.


> On Mar 7, 2019, at 1:34 PM, Rob Seastrom <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> 
> Dear Colleagues,
> Starting immediately after our annual meeting in late January, the ARIN AC 
> began curating a list of possible policy actions to take in response to the 
> Board's suspension of the waiting list policy.  We would like to share that 
> list of possible actions and comments with the Community.  While the attached 
> list of actions is not a policy proposal we hope that it will stimulate 
> constructive discussion regarding ARIN-2019-2, and possibly even lead to 
> submission of additional or supplementary policy proposals.  Current 
> discussions have already covered many of the topics that we raised.
> I have incorporated feedback on 2019-2 on PPML up to 1315 EST today.
> I'll be incorporating feedback on this thread into our working documents on 
> Friday, March 15th, so please expedite your thoughtful responses.
> Anticipating at least one complaint (and suffering from lack of confidence 
> that PPML won’t strip the RTF and render something entirely incomprehensible) 
> please accept my apologies for non-pure-ASCII email and accept my pointer to 
> this document in PDF format at 
> https://technotes.seastrom.com/assets/2019-03-07-NRPM-4-1-8-Policy-Actions/2019-03-07-NRPM-4-1-8-Policy-Actions.pdf
>  
> <https://technotes.seastrom.com/assets/2019-03-07-NRPM-4-1-8-Policy-Actions/2019-03-07-NRPM-4-1-8-Policy-Actions.pdf>
> Kind regards,
> -r
> 
> Problem Space
> 
> Returned and/or reclaimed number resources, are stranded at ARIN absent 
> policy enabling their distribution. These resources are of two primary 
> sources: organizations quitclaiming (voluntarily surrendering) prefixes and 
> number resources that are revoked due to non-compliance with the RSA 
> (primarily non-payment of fees).
> This pool must be drained in an orderly fashion. This must be sustainable to 
> provide a buffer/queue system to manage any future free pools, with an 
> orderly in/out sequence. At some point the demand vs return rate of IPv4 
> space will be such that we transition rapidly back and forth between having 
> an ephemeral free pool and a waiting list and it is important to consider 
> fair and impartial issue of number resources under that circumstance.
> A non-trivial fraction of the space issued under the 4.1.8 waitlist policy is 
> "flipped" as soon as it becomes eligible, after the current hold down of 1 
> year post-issue. This problem seems exacerbated in larger allocations 
> (shorter prefixes). Conversations in the wake of 4.1.8’s suspension (both 
> private and public) suggest that the now-suspended waiting list policy is not 
> aligned with its original intent.
> Policy action taken could reduce the incentive for fraudulent applications or 
> making misrepresentations to registration services (which have existed since 
> time immemorial). The observed flipping pattern raises serious concerns about 
> the legitimacy of the "documented need" attached to some applications.
> The ARIN community established the waiting list intentionally without many 
> controls with the expectation that we would need to adjust it over time with 
> the benefit of experience and observation.
> While by no means a universal sentiment, several people have raised the issue 
> of serving organizations that are unable to otherwise participate in the 
> transfer market in a meaningful way. This implies certain NGOs, smaller 
> organizations, new entrants, etc.
> Discussion:
> 
> While I generally agree with the problem statements...  I'm not sure they are 
> all problems that the wait-list policy update needs to "solve".  Specifically 
> problem 6.  While I think its nice that the wait-list is available to 
> organizations which may not have the funds available to get a block on the 
> market.  The “economist” in me says that if that an organization really needs 
> IPv4 addressing then they will put their resources (dollars) to work to find 
> a block (even via transfer).  If they don't really "need" a block, they will 
> likely use (borrow/lease) someone else's or substitute NAT.   And that might 
> just be OK.
> While all things being equal, I could potentially agree, the reality is that 
> these blocks aren't on the transfer market for whatever reason and I don't 
> think ARIN should be in the business of providing opportunities for others to 
> monetize them (isn't that the whole issue that caused the policy suspension 
> in the first place?). Thus, I think that the class most in need and least 
> likely to look at monetization is, in fact, the groups identified in item 6 
> above.
> a meta-issue to consider is whether there should be any difference between 
> IPv4 issuance via waiting list and IPv4 issuance via NRPM 4.2/4.3 when 
> resources are available; i.e.  should NRPM 4.1.8 simply read that ARIN will 
> maintain an ordered waiting list when resources are not available and fullfil 
> in that order once space becomes available – and then simplified criteria for 
> how a party receives IP space is put in NRPM 4.2 and NRPM 4.3.  If this is 
> not the strategy taken, then a party put on the waiting list last week and 
> then receiving space today (due to new influx of resources) will be treated 
> quite differently under a revised 4.1.8 policy than parties applying and 
> issued space from the replenished pool tomorrow.  Such oscillations are 
> nethier predictable nor particularly equitable, and yet will be a reality 
> (particular if the resources issued under revised waiting list policy are 
> limited in size.)   This is another way of characterizing problem #2 above - 
> differences between waiting list policy and "regular" issuance only increase 
> the inequity and thus morst of the policy options on the menu below probablem 
> shouldn't indicate they address statement #2... 
> An alternative approach to avoid oscillation would be to make the gate into 
> waiting list behavior a one-way gate. Once the waiting list is activated, 
> even if the queue is drained, all new applications would be placed on the 
> waiting list and immediately filled if possible. 
>  Certainly a possibility (one way gate... all new applications would be 
> placed on the waiting list and immediately filled if possible.) for 
> addressing the issue. 
> I could get behind part of the fix eliminating the possibility of oscillation 
> by the wait list becoming the universal front door; everyone in on the wait 
> list all the time and just the wait is short when resources are plentiful.
> It is not reasonable to ask the Community to weigh in policies based on 
> allegations of fraud without data from Registration Services ( + 3)
> Summary data posted to PPML in Message-ID: 
> <[email protected] 
> <mailto:[email protected]>>
> Sweeting's Policy Experience Report from ARIN 42 in Vancouveris available in 
> the following locations:
> Transcript:  
> https://www.arin.net/vault/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_42/ppm1_transcript.html#anchor_5
>  
> <https://www.arin.net/vault/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_42/ppm1_transcript.html#anchor_5>
>  
> Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJHgs4wWO58 
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJHgs4wWO58>
> Presentation: 
> https://www.arin.net/vault/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_42/PDF/PPM/sweeting-policy.pdf
>  
> <https://www.arin.net/vault/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_42/PDF/PPM/sweeting-policy.pdf>
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Potential Policy Actions
> 
> For brevity, the reclaimed or returned IPv4 resources received by ARIN 
> currently handled by the waitlist is referred to below as “4.1.8 space”.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Policy Menu for discussion
> 
> Regardless of any other policy options pursued for 4.1.8 space, we will need 
> to determine the fate of the current wait list entries. Do we use the new 
> waitlist policy as a forcing function (i.e. if there is a change in maximum 
> prefix size do we trim all existing justifications to be limited as under the 
> new policy), or do we grandfather prefix length, grants per org, etc under 
> the policy in effect as of the suspension date of the 4.1.8 policy 
> (Wednesday, 16 January 2019) or the publication of the Board minutes (7 
> February 2019)? Other cutoff dates seem less fair.
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5 plus overlay on particular policy actions
> Does not address: overlay on particular policy actions
> Discussion
> If "new policy applies to all unfilled requests". If an org takes a haircut 
> on what they can get from the waiting list, what happens to the remainder? Do 
> they lose it? Should they be able to turn it into a preapproval for 8.3?  We 
> believe that there are folks on the list *right now*, in the larger 
> allocation space, who are likely to "flip" space.  Is allowing them to keep 
> their place in line fair?
> Agreed. Given some existing applications could be fraudsters, the new policy 
> possibly should apply to existing applicants; OTOH new listers are the only 
> ones who knew the rules were changing. We should allow folks current on the 
> list who do not wish to participate in the new policy (fees, additional 
> paperwork, whatever) the option to delist without issue. Given some of the 
> options (eg, only one chance, no if you have other resources, etc) we would 
> be forcing many off the list regardless.
> reducing the size allocated will likely reduce the fraud potential.  I feel 
> that those on the list should be given the opportunity to keep their place on 
> the list (assuming we keep the list, but their max size would be reduced to 
> the new agreed max size.
> Tackling this first seems cart before the horse to me. I think that what we 
> decide on the other topics (how the policy actually changes) should inform 
> what we determine will be most fair to those on the existing waiting list. In 
> terms of if we reduce the maximum prefix size, then I would suggest that 
> perhaps we could pursue a compromise where those on the waiting list prior to 
> suspension aren't completely grandfathered, but are permitted a somewhat 
> (perhaps 2 bits or x4) larger maximum prefix size than the new limit. (e.g. 
> if we take the new limit to /24, those grandfathered would be eligible up to 
> a /22).
> It is a meta topic; these are only ordinal to be managable, feel free to skip 
> consideration until we assess the rest, but IMO that goes against the grain 
> of the desire to think things through well before discussing with the 
> community. As far as prefix size, I'm 100% against adding one-off bit-math 
> exception complexity. Simple grandfather or not is a reasonable discussion to 
> have but making a temporary new rule category is a bad idea.
> 4.1.8 space to be held in a “replenishment pool” for 4.4/4.10 (or similar)
> Addresses: 1, 2, 3, 5
> Does not address: 6
> Discussion
> Depending upon the expansion of “4.4/4.10 (or similar)” may or may not 
> address item 4. Highminded and while “orderly” (2) I think would result in 
> very little payout, eventually not addressing the pile (1). I doubt we’ll see 
> community support.
> Unlikely to see community support; also sends wrong message about the future 
> of IPv4.
> I'd suggest that using these blocks for 4.4/4.10 is possibly providing a way 
> for ARIN to serve the "small" members of the community by creating a larger 
> pool of small blocks that could be used for these new entrants.  Is it a lot 
> of space, no, but you can do a lot with a /24.
> I believe that this would create new incentives for fraud in the 4.10 space 
> which is already strongly incentivized towards fraud (almost with 
> encouragement from the ARIN staff via a very liberal interpretation of 
> "transition").
> Distribute 4.1.8 space with a one time issuance surcharge attached - "the 
> board should consider implementing a fee structure."
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5
> Does not address: 6
> Discussion
> Elevated fee for getting space from the waiting list. Possibly more fair than 
> putting it on the market. Definitely better optics. But if the target 
> recipients are organizations that are otherwise unable to participate in the 
> transfer market, then at least some organizations will be priced out.
> Possibly address items 3 & 4, but I’m concerned that the fee would have to be 
> significantto outweigh the ROI for people already willing to both wait and 
> risk their existing & future relationship with ARIN. Might be useful in 
> combination with other actions.
> I think the negatives of this approach for the classs defined in 6 outweigh 
> any possible positives for 1, 2, 5. I do not believe it will do anything for 
> 3, 4 unless the fees are so high as to approach parity with the transfer 
> market. I nominate this one for the considered and rejected bucket.
> Make 4.1.8 space non-transferrable (must return to ARIN).
> Addresses: 1, 2, 3, 5
> Does not address: 6
> Discussion
> Does this mean just no 8.3? How about 8.2? Disadvantage - basically makes 
> "off the books" transfers the only way to transfer the space. We have put a 
> lot of effort into making the database right. This creates the problem that 
> we have been trying to avoid.
> Given the waiting list isn’t the only path to get v4 I’m not certain the risk 
> of the underground market is very high. Were we back in the times before the 
> transfer market, I would solidly agree. However I don’t think this would gain 
> community support unless it was in combination with other actions. Given that 
> response, whether or not item 4 is addressed seems to be in play.
> non-transferable still means people can lease/reallocate. 
> Let's be clear about this... I believe it should mean (no 8.3) and  no (8.4 
> except in case where would otherwise qualify under 8.2). Perhaps some 
> additional hoops should be added for 8.2/8.2-related 8.4 (possibly restore 
> the resource review and reclamation provisions where 4.1.8 space is 
> involved?) . 
> I don't see this as not adressing 6. I also think it strongly addresses 4. It 
> might not reduce incentives for fraudulent transfers of space received under 
> this policy, but it does at least reduce the incentives to apply fraudulently 
> in the first place. I would say Addresses: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 (to varying 
> extents).
> The reason I put 'does not address 6' is it does not specifically favor or 
> disfavour.
> I agree that the reduction of the incentives to apply and flip will be 
> greatly reduced. I am concerned with M&A transfers as many times, equipment 
> gets moved over and the IPs come along with that. Giving space back that 
> happened to be from the waiting list at some point would impact companies 
> greatly. There is an actual need for that space and not a resource flip for 
> money. Reallocations would be allowed so I see no issues in that regard. This 
> in conjunction with smaller aggs from the waiting list would probably give us 
> the a very good start. 
> Longer holddown period for transfer after receiving 4.1.8 space
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5
> Does not address: 6
> Discussion
> Could be a disincentive for people who are gaming the system for financial 
> gain. Might just end up turning transfers into LOAs and rentals. In the 
> interests of database accuracy we still need to allow 8.2
> I have the same concerns with items 3 & 4 as with policy option for “suggest 
> fees to board”. We have a serious unknown WRT the level of disincentive 
> needed. Might be useful in combination.
> I think this is just a less-effective alternative to D. I nominate this one 
> for the considered and rejected bucket on that basis.
> If we are talking about 2+ years then I think we'd see an impact as companies 
> would gamble the cost of the IP but I like option D better. 
> Only one 4.1.8 application / grant per applicant (no getting back in line/one 
> bite at the apple)
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5, 6
> Does not address: 3, 4
> Discussion
> Increases the overhead for milking the system (creating multiple corporate 
> entities, etc) but this may not be as much overhead as we suppose; legitimate 
> businesses spin up operating entities at the drop of a hat. Sends signal 
> about "new entrants". Creates the problem that RIPE NCC has right now - 
> because they did that for their final /8, there are a lot of shell LIRs that 
> were created for the sole purpose of getting the space.
> Similar to options for “suggest fees to board” & long holddown”, I think this 
> only moves the line for fraud, and not very far. We should not ignore RIPE’s 
> shell LIR experience and I don’t think their fix would apply for us. I don’t 
> think this is a useful lever in conjunction with other options.
> I think this is a high staff impact low fraudster impact mechanism for moving 
> the bar on fraud only slightly. As such, I nominate it for the considered and 
> rejected bucket.
> No 4.1.8 applications for any existing V4 resource holder
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5, 6
> Does not address: 3, 4
> Discussion
> Same as “no getting back in line” - creating shell organizations for the 
> purpose of getting space from ARIN. TODO - Get quotes from 
> https://www.delreg.com <https://www.delreg.com/>for fixed and variable costs 
> of setting up a shell corporation and add in the minimum documentation 
> overhead to make a model.
> I’m sure I could spend time finding current rates, but here’s 2015 data, that 
> sticks to my “very low” answer 
> https://blog.corpnet.com/fees-incorporating-state-understand-costs-corporation/
>  
> <https://blog.corpnet.com/fees-incorporating-state-understand-costs-corporation/>.
>  I don’t think the community would support this nor that it would be 
> meaningful in conjunction with other actions. I think this should be demoted 
> to “considered and rejected”.
> Last year, I needed to spin up an entity. I hired a service to do all of it 
> beginning to end for $150 and about 15 minutes of filling out web forms. (If 
> I had known what I was doing with the web forms, I probably could have done 
> it in more like 2 minutes).
> To me, this is just a more obnoxious form of F and I believe it should suffer 
> the same suggested fate.
> FWIW, APNIC is considering abolishment of their waiting list. Since they had 
> a soft-landing policy, they are considering reserving reclaimed resources for 
> new entrants only, similar to this option: 
> https://www.apnic.net/community/policy/proposals/prop-129 
> <https://www.apnic.net/community/policy/proposals/prop-129>.
> Additional officer attestation at time of being placed on waiting list (or at 
> time of issuance? or both?), under penalty of perjury of lack of relationship 
> to any other organization that is on the waiting list.
> Addresses: 1, 2, 4
> Does not address: 3, 5, 6
> Discussion
> This is out of the purview of the AC as it does not relate directly to number 
> policy however it may be part of our guidance to the Board that they discuss 
> such a measure with Counsel.  
> I don’t know how much of the fraud this would actual cut into, being a 
> reference to other entities on the list.
> Rather than reference other entities on the list, I would suggest it 
> reference other entities which have received 4.1.8 waiting list approval 
> and/or space.
> It might not reduce fraud by much (or it might reduce it a lot). However, it 
> seems very low staff overhead with good potential. I think combined with 
> other options, notably {D, I.(J, K, or L)}
> My understanding is that formal attestations increase the hooks for hanging 
> fraud-related complaints on should they be egregious enough to send to LE 
> etc, so it may be inefficient at cutting into fraud yet still desirable.
> Reduce maximum allocation for 4.1.8 space (general action - subsequent are 
> more specific)
> Addresses: 1, 2, 4, 5, 6
> Does not address:
> Discussion
> 
> Advantages
> Increases the number of organizations that can be served.
> Lessens the impact of "loophole applications" that make it through
> The necessity of repeated transactions (grant events) in order to amass a 
> significant amount of space increases the paper trail for detecting 
> undesirable behavior.
> Disadvantages
> Some otherwise deserving organizations will not be able to get all the space 
> they can justify regardless of how long they are willing to wait.
> More grant events (i.e. more number blocks being handed out) and attendant 
> shortening of waiting period may increase incidence of loophole or fraudulent 
> applications.
> Increased workload on Registration Services (operational issue outside of the 
> scope of our policy discussion)
> I think this is a required piece of any solution. Reduces but wouldn’t 
> eliminate 3
> I also think this is a required part of any solution as long as the solution 
> isn't "transfer at market price"
> Agree this is the single best action we can take and is likely improved by 
> combining with other action(s) (notably D)
> Per item 6, I'm less concerned about deserving organizations getting limited 
> space.
> While it does shorten the "waiting period", it wouldn't remove the 3 month 
> hold-down in the policy (unless we did so deliberately). We could combine 
> with (E) to further address the "attendant shortening" issue.
> Agree with the comments above that this needs to be part of the solution but 
> not the only solution
> Reduce maximum 4.1.8 allocations to /24 (or more likely "minimum allocation 
> as elsewhere in policy")
> Addresses: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6
> Does not address: n/a
> Discussion
> 
> Advantages
> Serves the most number of organizations
> Maximally reduces fraud incentive, particularly when combined with "one grant 
> per applicant"
> Maximizes grant events (see I.c.c above) for detecting activity by bad actors
> RIPE is about to do it (see RIPE-2019-02:Reducing IPv4 Allocations to a /24) 
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/policies/proposals/2019-02 
> <https://www.ripe.net/participate/policies/proposals/2019-02>https://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/address-policy-wg/2019-February/012623.html
>  
> <https://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/address-policy-wg/2019-February/012623.html>
> Disadvantages
> Maximizes the number of organizations that could justify more yet are 
> shortchanged
> I think this is the biggest bang for our buck, solo or in combination. This 
> and “recommend fees” and [another option] would be best IMO.
> If we are going to reduce to a /24 why not just put these in the 4.10 pool, 
> then we give people a carrot to also do the right thing and get some v6 to 
> bootstrap their organization
> Re 4.10 pool, That's not the original intent of 4.10, though it is how staff 
> is currently advertising it. IMHO, we should move away from 4.10 being used 
> for v4 for people who joined the v6 club and go back to actually requiring 
> 4.10 space be used for actual transition purposes.
> I sort of agree but I feel that it might be more bang than is needed and that 
> the downside to any but the smallest of the small may exceed the benefit.
> This or K in combination with D would be my suggestion as well. I'm on the 
> fence for /24 vs /22 as there are certainly pluses and minus to each 
> approach. Also making specified transfered not able to use wait list space 
> will really disincentivize the flippers. 
> Reduce maximum 4.1.8 allocations to /22
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5
> Does not address: 3, 4, 6
> Discussion
> 
> Still substantially no questionable applications at this level under today's 
> policies
> Able to serve a greater diversity of organizations that could justify more 
> space than a /24 (think WISP, boutique cloud providers).
> RIPE has had documented experience with a /22 policy along with negligible 
> amounts of documentation (pretty much a gimme for any new LIR). Note that 
> ARIN != RIPE and we are not discussing getting rid of needs basis for this. 
> Whether the RIPE experience counts as a success story is likely in the eyes 
> of the beholder, but we have something to calibrate our expectations against.
> I think the RIPE experience pushes away from this, and that the line for 
> fraud would just move here as a /22 is still highly valuable.
>  /22 seems like a good place to start the discussion on a new max block size
> I agree with the /22.
> Will the fraud line move here? Possibly, but the incentive to overhead ratio 
> changes dramatically (1 application + 1 year = /16 = roughly $1,310,570 
> ($20/address - $150 ARIN fee) vs. 64 Entity spinups + 64 applications + 1 
> year = badly fragmented /16 equivalent = roughly $1,301,120 ($20/address - 
> 64*$150 ARIN fees)
> I believe this combined with D is probably our best choice.
> Increased number of transactions going past Registration Services is good for 
> discerning patterns.
> if increased transactions are good, then isn't that an even better argument 
> for (J) and moving to /24s?
> I'm having trouble squaring that 'overhead' and your comments under (G) - 64 
> orgs per your experience would be under 10k so the profit is barely touched 
> (1.29M vs 1.31M). I have neverseen shell creation/shelf activation as a 
> significant barrier; while they seem weird to us as engineers, criminal 
> enterprises are very very used to them being a required part of doing illegal 
> business.
> I believe this or J in combination with D is the best choice. I could 
> probably be convinced either way on /24 or /22. 
> RIPE's experience has been a train wreck and organizations have plundered the 
> /22 space to where certain recipients have amassed in the low hundreds of 
> /22s each.
> Not fair to equate RIPE's experience with /22s.  There is no justification 
> requirement in RIPE. Form a corp, have a presence in the RIPE region, and you 
> get a /22 whether you can justify it or not.
> Reduce maximum 4.1.8 allocations to /21 or /20
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5
> Does not address: 3, 4, 6
> Discussion
> :
> Advantages
> Still substantially no questionable applications at this level under today's 
> policies
> Disadvantages
> at 8 or 16x the payout per transaction, a tempting place for attempted 
> loopholing to land.
> Nevertheless, a loophole /20 consumes 1/16 the resources of a loophole /16 
> (most of these are in the /17-/18 range but still...)
>  I don’t think this level of incrementalism will buy us much of anything.
> /22 seems like a good place to start the discussion on a new max block size
> I don't believe this gains us anything as this isn't small enough. Smaller 
> allocations serve more members of the ARIN community. I'm more comfortable 
> with a /22 or /24
> 
> 
> 
> Policy options considered and rejected
> 
> No longer reissue 4.1.8 space (i.e. continue waiting list suspension 
> indefinitely)
> Addresses: 3, 4, 5
> Does not address: 1, 2, 6
> Discussion
> Functionally equivalent to eliminating the waiting list. Unlikely to get 
> community support and with the (actually a little surprising) velocity of 
> space reclamation ARIN will eventually end up with a non-trivial amount of 
> space.
> firmly agreed.
> I wouldn't reject this one so quickly; it doesn't make any sense if we sit on 
> the space, but if it could be redeployed (my favorite option: use as supply 
> for crit infra allocations), this could be a viable path.
> The counterpoint to that preference is that the current CI pool will last 
> much longer than any of us want IPv4 to continue to be CI.
> ARIN Stops accepting applications for 4.1.8 space, only supporting transfer 
> (8.x), critical infrastructure (4.4), or IPv6 transition (4.10) policies
> Addresses: 3, 4, 5
> Does not address: 1, 2, 6
> Discussion
> Closes down the entry side of the policy, not the issuance side. Net result 
> ends up being the same - can't have requests for the space, so it will pile 
> up.
> firmly agreed.
> This is smilar to the B above, so why is this specifically rejected it seems 
> similar.
> Prioritize "not for profit" organizations’ applications for 4.1.8 space, 
> potentially to the exclusion of all others.
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5, 6
> Does not address: 3, 4
> Discussion
> such status is merely an artifact of national tax laws; they say nothing 
> about budgets or size.
> agreed; would include superPACs in the US.
> I think there is value in considering this as an option for discussion.  I 
> suspect it doesn't go anywhere, but I think its worth while.
> Could limit it to "organizations eligible to receive tax deductible 
> donations" which would eliminate PACs (including superPACs). Would still 
> allow some very large organizations (e.g. Red Cross, UNICEF), but I'm not 
> sure that's entirely bad if we include the size limits under discussion as 
> subcategories for I (especially J or K).
> I agree that this should be modified and discussed, not rejected out of hand.
>  "tax deductiblity" is a rathole you don't want to go down unless you want to 
> be incredibly US/Canada-centric about it (which I don't).
> I don't see how this could be tuned into effectiveness across our entire 
> service area, and strongly underscore the point that scope and budget of "not 
> for profit" doesn't limit to 'good works' organizations and for that matter 
> expressly excludes B corporations.
> I take issue with characterizing any of this work done as 'out of hand'; the 
> text here is a summary and tiny fraction of the discussions. The only "quick" 
> decision was 'business as usual' being a non-starter.
> Return to waiting list Business As Usual (Status quo - we decide that we are 
> OK with continuing on the previous path)
> Addresses: 1, 2
> Does not address: 3, 4, 5, 6
> Discussion
> In view of the circumstances that caused the Board to suspend the policy, I 
> don’t believe this is viable.
> agreed.
> I agree we can reject this option
> Given the board's suspension of the policy, I doubt such an action would be 
> favored by the board. I agree this is not a viable option.
> Agreed.
> Distribute 4.1.8 space via the transfer market
> Addresses: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5
> Does not address: 6
> Discussion
> Obviously this is 8.3 not 8.2  :) Money would go to ARIN, is there something 
> that this money could go to? Membership cost reduction? Fellowship? 
> Education? Bad optics because it looks like ARIN is incented to be aggressive 
> about reclaiming space.
> Actually addresses many of the currently-defined issues, but it smells bad to 
> me.
> This is similar to setting of a fee for wait-list allocations, only that it 
> is done with the assistance of a 3rd party setting the price.  I prefer a 
> simple fee which would be adjusted annually which is a discount from the 
> anticipated market price.
> The boquet of limburger with the appearance of Medusa... Yeah, you are right 
> about the optics and aroma.
> I'm not so skeptical that this approach should be rejected. Removing/reducing 
> the profit motive for fraudulent applications would be an effective path to 
> curbing the abuse, and I feel that at least this should be floated as an 
> option with the community.
> removing the profit motive this way is very punitive to organizations that 
> are legitimately on the waiting list. I'd hate to see ARIN end up chasing its 
> tail the way ICANN is with their new domain make money fast slush fund.
> At least three strong statements of support on PPML for this.
> Reduce maximum 4.1.8 allocation to /19 or /18
> Addresses: 1, 2, 5
> Does not address: 3, 4, 6
> Discussion
> 
> Disadvantages
> Doesn't really move the needle when we are seeing questionable applications 
> in this range already
> More a BAU policy than a smaller maximum allocation policy (current max 
> waitlist is not codified in 4.1.8. but as a practical manner tops out around 
> a /16 or maybe a /15?).
> Extremely large waitlist prefixes that take literally years to bear fruit 
> cause one to question the legitimacy of the "need" that was documented to 
> ARIN.
> again, minor incrementalism that if anything will teach the fraudsters how to 
> adapt.
> limited value in the promotion of larger blocks.  If the community really 
> wants larger blocks they will say so when we publish the new max size of "/22"
> 
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