On 02/05/2019 07:30, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via ARIN-PPML wrote:
So, you’re saying that if an ARIN member is **acting** against the
exclusive rights of use resources allocated to other members, not by
accident, and repeatedly, is just **fine** and ARIN should not even
remind the member that he is acting against the rules?
I think this sentence resumes well this issue.
For those who believe is out of scope try to think that it is NOT about
determining what people will do with their routers or their network, but
it IS about the RIR, a membership model entity to define and state what
kind of rules apply for members to continue being members, like for
example not try to invade someoneelse's right. I really can't see what
is wrong in having this obvious rule in place so why I believe it is in
scope.
Regards
Fernando
Regards,
Jordi
El 2/5/19 8:59, "ARIN-PPML en nombre de Owen DeLong"
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> en
nombre de [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> escribió:
On May 1, 2019, at 18:08 , Fernando Frediani
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
On 01/05/2019 17:17, Joe Provo wrote:
"Distribution function" is indeed merely agreeing that the
data
recorded in the registry is accurate. There's no
dibursement of
anything. When we bought our house and land, the registry of
deeds was similar only involved in verifying that the transfer
from the previous holders to us was a valid contract
within the
scope of its operations (the state in which we live). When a
neighbor was doing a construction project and we had to go
block
their heavy equipment, the registrar of deeds sure didn't come
and settle the dispute. We went down, got the county map and
they agreed. if they hadn't, law enforcement and courts would
have been the next step.
This, like all Internet analogies, is poor; my thrust is
that rfg's
is worse. To parallel ARIN with a transportation agency's
"line
drawing" and officials embued with law enforcement is
wildly off
track.
That's not that same thing unfortunately. Your house and land
belong to you until you sell it, the resources the RIR assign
to people **never** belong to them, they are not a property.
Instead they remain under their responsibility and they may
unassigned if misused or for other reasons.
The following is strictly my opinion. It may well deviate from
the legal theories under which the RIRs currently operate.
The county can revoke your deed if you don’t pay your property
taxes.
ARIN can revoke your registration if you don’t pay your ARIN fees.
The county can revoke your deed if they find that it was
recorded under fraudulent pretense.
ARIN can revoke your resources if they find your registration
was obtained under fraudulent pretense.
The only difference is in what is being registered/recorded by
the different registries. The property registry in the various
counties registers property.
ARIN registers numbers to guarantee uniqueness among
cooperating parties.
As has been repeatedly stated in this debate, ARIN has no
control or authority over non-cooperating parties that have not
signed a contract with ARIN.
An entity which has no contract with the RIRs really can use
any integers they want in any way they want to the extent that
others are willing to accept that use.
If someone wants to claim 10.0.0.0/8 as a public address and
route it on the internet, the RIRs cannot do anything to stop them
unless it violates an RIR contract that said entity is a party to.
If they can find enough ISPs willing to route that on their
behalf, then de facto, that address range will be theirs and it
really doesn’t matter what the RIRs have to say about it.
The internet works because the vast majority of networks choose
to cooperate with the RIR system and work within the system to
preserve uniqueness.
There’s no law that prevents this from becoming balkanized and
disintegrating into competing non-unique uses of address space. I
hope that doesn’t happen and fortunately, there’s enough financial
interest in the process to make sure the majority of ISPs continue
to not want it as well.
Nonetheless, it is important to understand just how fragile
this ecosystem actually is and just how limited the power of the
RIRs actually is.
Owen
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