I am sure we are talking about the same thing David.
The authority to establish the rules in which resources are allocated
and revoked is a prerogative from this forum (which includes members and
non-members), as in any other RIR. The PDP guarantees the Board the
ultimate authority to adopt a new policies in order to make sure it is
in line with all legal and operational aspects of the RIR system.
The authority to establish fee structure, operational procedures, etc is
a prerogative from the Board and Staff.
Fernando
On 16/01/2021 22:15, David Farmer wrote:
No it doesn’t, that authority comes from the membership, not this
policy forum. Yes, there is significant overlap between the two, but
they are distinct groups.
On Sat, Jan 16, 2021 at 18:23 Fernando Frediani <fhfredi...@gmail.com
<mailto:fhfredi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi David
I am not against it has, but it does because the authority given
to them for that come from this forum (for the revocation part not
the fee structure).
4.2.1.2 makes it very clear and doesn't go into any operational
details and this proposal is willing to remove it.
Fernando
On 16/01/2021 20:42, David Farmer wrote:
The Board has the power to set fees, which includes at least the
power to revoke resources for nonpayment. If it did not, the
power to set fees would be meaningless.
Thanks
On Sat, Jan 16, 2021 at 5:29 PM Fernando Frediani
<fhfredi...@gmail.com <mailto:fhfredi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
John, let's make it simple: The Board has no power to *make
and adopt policies* concerning resources allocation without
passing in this forum. Look: make policies not just adopt them !
Yes we all understand it has the ultimate authority to adopt
all ARIN's policies, but it *cannot make and adopt any
policies by itself*. That is a sole prerogative from this
forum to initiate, discuss and agree on it to *then* pass it
to them for approval.
Therefore Board has no power to determine the conditions for
resources to be allocated or revoked. This forum does and why
I am of that the current text is fine to remain as it is as
it is not causing any trouble and doesn't go into any
operational details.
The text in the proposal doesn't refer to how fees are
structured, but only mentions that lack of payment is a
reason for revocation (again a sole prerogative of this forum
to define not the Board). In other words the authority for
ARIN to revoke resources always comes from this forum.
As a suggestion to this proposal why not make more clear and
something similar to what LACNIC has which mentions that
violations to the contract leads to revocation ?
Fernando
On 16/01/2021 19:30, John Curran wrote:
On 16 Jan 2021, at 3:39 PM, Fernando Frediani
<fhfredi...@gmail.com <mailto:fhfredi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Exactly John, that's why the Board of Trustees or
equivalent body has to approve policies that advances from
this forum, to make sure they are in line with the
applicable law, operational impacts, etc. But the Board has
not power to make policies or define rules for allocation
of revocation.
Fernando -
That is also incorrect in the ARIN region (“But the Board
has not power to make policies or define rules for
allocation of revocation.”) The ARIN Board of Trustees has
the full authority of the organization, having been elected
by the membership - this includes the ultimate authority to
adopt all of ARIN’s number resource policies. In its deep
wisdom, the ARIN Board of Trustees adopted a Policy
Development Process that delegates and constrains its role
in the normal course of policy development, but that does
not change the underlying authority to define the policies
by which ARIN operates.
More important to highlight is that any policies regarding
allocation of revocation come exclusively from this forum.
If this forum defines lack of payment is one of that
reasons for revocation of resources and Board approves it
according to the PDP, then the Board is free to adjust the
RSA and whatever procedures necessary to make it happen.
Again, that is not the case in the ARIN region, and it might
be best if you refrain from make assertions regarding the
functioning of authority in the ARIN region without further
research. Note - I am also available at any time if you
wish to discuss specifics of ARIN authority and operation -
feel free to reach out to me to arrange if needed.
What I am saying with is that it is in its prerogatives for
this forum to keep in the policy text that lack of payment
is a reason for revocation. There is not reason to remove
what is in there, it will not cause any harm or conflict to
whatever the Board decides the RSA will be.
The policy writeup notes "The AC’s understanding is that
community policy should not include language referring to
fees, as such language is already present in the
Registration Services Agreement (RSA)” – this statement is
accurate, which suggests that the proposed change to policy
text is well-considered.
Thanks,
/John
John Curran
President and CEO
American Registry for Internet Numbers
_______________________________________________
ARIN-PPML
You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML@arin.net
<mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net>).
Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
<https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml>
Please contact i...@arin.net <mailto:i...@arin.net> if you
experience any issues.
--
===============================================
David Farmer Email:far...@umn.edu <mailto:email%3afar...@umn.edu>
Networking & Telecommunication Services
Office of Information Technology
University of Minnesota
2218 University Ave SE
<https://www.google.com/maps/search/2218+University+Ave+SE?entry=gmail&source=g>
Phone: 612-626-0815
Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952
===============================================
_______________________________________________
ARIN-PPML
You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML@arin.net
<mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net>).
Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
<https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml>
Please contact i...@arin.net <mailto:i...@arin.net> if you
experience any issues.
--
===============================================
David Farmer Email:far...@umn.edu <mailto:email%3afar...@umn.edu>
Networking & Telecommunication Services
Office of Information Technology
University of Minnesota
2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815
Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952
===============================================
_______________________________________________
ARIN-PPML
You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML@arin.net).
Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
Please contact i...@arin.net if you experience any issues.
