Ram -
How can I thank you more!
You are so sensitive--and your memory!!!
BR
mm
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 08:30:00 -0600From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL
PROTECTED]: Re: [Assam] article from outlookindia.com- Indian Education
rote-tonCC: [email protected]
Dear Mukul da,
You did wake up some far away memories. This is verse from John Bunyan's Little
Sheperd Boy. I vaguely remembered a few lines, for the rest Google helped out.
Here is the the complete verse:
(Interesting;y enough, the Bible refers to humility in a number of places -
both James and Luke make quite a few references on a similar theme, and so does
our Gita)
HE that is down needs fear no fall,
He that is low, no pride;
He that is humble ever shall
Have God to be his guide.
I am content with what I have,
5
Little be it or much:
And, Lord, contentment still I crave,
Because Thou savest such.
Fullness to such a burden is
That go on pilgrimage:
10
Here little, and hereafter bliss,
Is best from age to age.
--Ram
On 6/23/07, mc mahant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Dear Ram, Shall appreciate if you can mail the full short verse "He that is
low Needs
fear no fall
-------------
He that is humble
--------------
Shall have God to be his Guide." I searched a
lot but nobody seems to remember this simple one.Thanksmm
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 21:07:49 -0600From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL
PROTECTED]: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Re: [Assam] article from outlookindia.com -
Indian Education rote-ton
Umesh,
Too many people and too many times relegate rote learning to the dogs.
Even today, I can "vomit" out the Psalm of Life by Longfellow for the most
part or even some passages from Shakespeare, Robert Browning, Keats or Shaw.
(and I wasn't a literature major).
And, I am not trying to show off here - I think there are many with that same
Indian education who can do the same or better than I.
When I was forced to do the rote learning both at St. Edmunds and even at Don
Bosco, Guwahati, I barely understood what these passges meant and hated those
classes. The same went for history or Gandhian struggle etc.
The question is if these important or valuable? Or who cares?
IMHO - literature and other "impractical" studies make our education wholesome.
I think, all subject areas are important. The methods of learning may be
different, and some may be better than others - as for me rote learning and the
mastor with the stick made all the difference whether or not I learned.
--Ram da
On 6/22/07, umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ram-da,I agree with you partially. We do need rote memorization fr many things
-- like learning new vocabulary words (ofcourse, you can improve your knowledge
of these by different techniques - such as using them in own words, match the
following, flash cards - etc --- but it all amounts to rote ). We all learn a
language by rote (and practice) - same with terms of history, biology etc.
Ofcourse, the more you use these terms the better you get at remembering them.
Further, most Indian students have more practical experience than most in USA -
atleast till they are teenagers. Tom Sawyer style of "adventurous learning" is
no longer possible in USA - since no student/child (below age 14) can go
anywhere without escort. Further, most gardening, plumbing, auto
repair/maintenance , cleaning is now done by hired staf in USA - so no
practical learning about electricity and electrical and mechanical appliances.
Ofcourse, beyond the basic knowledge thru rote - one must learn to apply the
knowledge in various situations - in which Indian student lack - mostly. Some
intelliegent ones are able to put two and two together and get by - or go
abroad. That is street smartness - as the auhor wrote in his best seller book
"What they don't teach at Harvard Business Schoo" - a required reading at HBS
itself.UmeshRam Sarangapani < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
C'da,
Thanks for forwarding this rather well-written article. I must say, it makes
wonderful reading and does make one have second thoughts about the quality of
education that most of us have received from India. :)
Even with that didactic//memorizing by rote background, I came away with a few
of things here: :)
The first, of course, is that people can be taught (often complex things) even
if they have had no formal education.
The second, of course, is that, I find it a tad preposterous, that Dunu Roy
thinks that education in India as "Instead, we have didactic instruction,
memorising by rote, and vomiting out useless information for futile
examinations... "
The third, of course, is that according to Dunu Roy, the Govt. is pretty
useless, ie. whatever they touched (his illustrations here) have been baseless,
miscalculated, and ultimately, Roy and his group, had to go teach the
"practical/down-to-earth" stuff to the affected people, and make the
corrections.
I have no argument with the first point - I do think it is highly possible to
teach people to perform and operate complex procedures, if they are willing to
learn and taught well.
The notion that education in India is totally impractical I find it had to
believe. You, me, and most NRIs have had this didactic education (including
Roy). I really wonder, how, Roy & his group of intellectuals managed to get out
of that mold?
Most Indians too have this background too. Then, how is it that they manage to
do very well in this country? How is it that they have not only done well in
school in this country, but have proved to be one of the smartest in opening up
successful start-ups (not just IT), and doing great.
I don't know. Probably Roy will tell us.
On the third point, it is quite easy to take pot shots at the Govt. machinery.
and its incompetence. While I commend Roy and his group (are they some anti-dam
people:) in taking the trouble to do a better job teaching than the education
system, I wonder, if Roy can recommend that method for the whole country, and
if that will be workable.
--Ram
On 6/22/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Knowledge As Weapon Ordinary working people have the capacity to learn, to
collect information, to look at it analytically, and eventually use it for
bettering their own lives. This is, or should be, the central objective of
"education". Instead, we have didactic instruction, memorising by rote, and
vomiting out useless information for futile examinations... Dunu Roy
It was some 30 years ago, in the mid-70s, that we got a glimpse of what the
future might hold. We had just purchased 2 acres of land to build a workshop
on, in the district of Shahdol in Madhya Pradesh. There had been some argument
with the neighbouring owner about where exactly the boundary lay. So one day we
dragged out the iron chain that surveyors use, and began measuring the land
ourselves. A curious shepherd boy must have witnessed the proceedings, because
next day a delegation of solemn farmers from the nearby village paid us a
visit. They had heard that we were engineers, they explained, so could we teach
them how to measure land? Why, we asked, whatever will you do with it? Well,
they explained, the patwari (the government revenue functionary at the village)
had been demarcating their lands and they were never sure whether he was doing
it right. So we spent the next four hours demonstrating how the chain worked
and how to calculate the area. In the process, of course, we began to learn
that the chain was called a jareeb, the area was rakba, the khasra number
referred to the record in the revenue department, their title was the patta,
and the patwari presided over a khatauni in which all secrets were well
documented.
A week later, the same delegation was back, but looking less solemn and more
brashly conspiratorial. Could they borrow our jareeb? We handed over the chain
and then, not a little puzzled ourselves, we followed them at a discreet
distance. In due course, we arrived at the village and a curious spectacle
greeted us. On the farms of the village, the patwari was laying out his chain,
and wherever he went, the farmers followed with their borrowed jareeb and laid
it out in exactly the same manner. At every halt they would watch the patwari
and when he began to enter figures in his notebook, they too would whip out a
pencil and scribble on a piece of paper. Rarely had we seen a more harassed
looking patwari! At the end of the day, the delegation was back again, beaming
from ear to ear. Thank you for the hathiyaar (weapon), they told us, and handed
back the jareeb. Can we, we asked them, see what you wrote? They took out their
smudged piece of paper and showed it to us. It was covered with a series of
numbers in meaningless disorder. But, they grinned, they had taken care not to
show it to the patwari! This theme of knowledge as weapon has come back to us
many times in the last three decades. In the mid-80s, a small party from the
Palamau district of Bihar knocked on our door. Could we come to their village
and see what the proposed dam on the Auranga river was going to do to their
area? We said yes, but provided they were able to wrangle a copy of the DPR
(Detailed Project Report) of the dam. Oh, no problem, they remarked, the
irrigation department chaprasi (peon) was from their village. So, three weeks
later, we were rambling across the farmlands of Palamau inspecting the river
and its catchment and comparing it to what was written in the DPR. We were
faced with a battery of questions. Look at that river, exclaimed the villagers,
do you think it can carry as much water as to irrigate all the lands the
department is claiming it will? And can you see the silt in it; how long will
it take for the dam to fill up? The department says that this village will come
under submergence, and that one will not, when we can clearly see that this
village is higher than that one! How can we challenge their views? We took
four days to instruct a batch of 20 young boys from the surrounding villages
how to measure the flow in the river, the silt load that it carried, and the
slope of the land.With that, they said, they would be able to take on the
project's claims of projected irrigation, the life of the dam, and the extent
of submergence. On the last evening, as we were packing to leave the next
morning, they eyed us suspiciously. Where, they asked, pointing to the "dumpy"
(a kind of telescopic instrument that is used to measure levels), are you
taking that? Well, we said, this is our instrument and we are taking it back;
if you want one you will have to get it for yourselves. How much does it cost,
they queried, and where is it available? The nearest place, we explained, would
be Ranchi and it would cost about Rs 3000. And then we retired for the night.
Only to be woken up by an exuberant hammering on the door very early the next
morning. Here, they said, is Rs 3000 collected from donations by all the
villagers, and you can go and buy the dumpy yourself; otherwise how will we
fight a yuddh (war) without an astra (weapon)? That the yuddh was joined became
clear to us when, four months later, a parcel arrived with the postman. It
contained a sheaf of papers containing the records of three months of daily
measurement. We went to work on the data and came up with some very interesting
findings indeed. The river, for instance, carried only half as much water in
the monsoon months as the DPR claimed it did. This water also bore a silt load
one-and-a-half times that of the figure reported in the project proposal. 25
villages were actually coming into the submergence zone, demarcated by
following the full reservoir contour, as compared to the 19 acknowledged by the
project authorities. When all these were factored into the calculations the
benefits actually came to less than the costs! This was going to be one very
unviable dam indeed, we informed the people of Auranga. They, in turn, took the
report and propagated it all over the area through posters and leaflets, while
the English version was duly sent off to the governments, the media, the
courts, and even the World Bank. Today, fifteen years later, the Auranga river
remains unbound. In the mid-90s, we had another set of visitors, but this time
from the high ranges of Kullu district in Himachal Pradesh. Their villages and
hamlets were being threatened by the declaration of the Great Himalayan
National Park. What exactly was this Park, they asked, and how could they
protect their families? So, two months later, armed with the relevant documents
and reports, we pitched camp in their village. A young bunch of grazers and
farmers listened attentively as we explained how the government had
commissioned a study in the 80s and how this study, conducted by a pair of
specialists from the Pheasant Society in the UK and Canada, had come to the
conclusion that only by declaring the Park as a protected area could the rare
Western Himalayan Tragopan (a ground-dwelling bird) be saved. And then, as we
presented the details of the study, the listeners grew restive. No, they
protested, it is not possible for the Tragopan to be disturbed by our herds
because it nests in late winter and our grazers go up only in late spring. Even
that figure of 25,000 animals is wrong, they objected, our numbers rarely cross
12,000. And it is not us who destroy the herbs, but the Nepali labourers from
the Terai, who are unfamiliar with alpine ecology and are hired by the traders
in the plains. We suggested to them then that they should do their own study
and compare their findings with what had been reported by the foreign experts.
Very well, they responded immediately, tell us how to do the study. So, for the
next two days, we demonstrated to them how to draw transects and conduct animal
counts, how to document the diversity of grasses and shrubs, and how to
systematically record their observations.As soon as the snows melted, six of
them headed towards the alpine meadows, following the same route that the
scientists had taken ten years earlier. Two porters who had been taken along to
ferry the supplies to base camp (at heights of over 3000 metres, one does not
run into the occasional tea shop or restaurant!), became so familiar with the
routines of measurement that they eventually became part of the study team. Six
weeks later they returned, armed with a range of documented observations. A
detailed examination of their records showed that they had successfully
challenged every one of the findings of the government-sponsored study. In
addition, their measurements indicated what was the carrying capacity of the
meadows, how ruminants were in fact controlling weed infestation, and how the
herbs could be harvested within the boundaries of conservation. This much,
then, is certain: people fight their struggles for survival based on what
knowledge they can create. Each one of the reports and studies cited above (and
numerous others that have not been documented in both rural and urban areas)
indicates that ordinary working people have the capacity to learn, to collect
information, to look at it analytically, and eventually use it for bettering
their own lives. This is, or should be, the central objective of "education".
And yet, these are simple (and yet very complex) tasks that are not undertaken
by our educational institutions. Didactic instruction, memorising by rote, and
vomiting out useless information for futile examinations constitute the
fundamentals of what passes for education in our schools and colleges. Perhaps
there is a purpose to it all. Perhaps another Macaulay is required to explain
it to us in yet another Minute. And perhaps, in some not too distant future, a
group of young labourers will learn to document their own lives to tear this
farce to pieces.
A graduate (and post-graduate) from IIT Bombay, Dunu Roy heads Hazard Centre in
New Delhi.
# You may be missing other accompanying blurbs, related stories, graphics
etc.Link to this story as it appears on the site :- Knowledge As
Weaponwww.outlookindia.com
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http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.orgUmesh SharmaWashington
D.C. 1-202-215-4328 [Cell]Ed.M. - International Education PolicyHarvard
Graduate School of Education,Harvard University,Class of
2005http://www.uknow.gse.harvard.edu/index.html (Edu info)http://hbswk.hbs.edu/
(Management Info)www.gse.harvard.edu/iep (where the above 2 are used
)http://jaipurschool.bihu.in/
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