On Sat, Aug 1, 2009 at 9:27 PM, Heiko Baums <[email protected]> wrote:
> Well, I'm not a TU, and can't vote, but keep in mind, what a TU is, > what TU means and what a TU's task is. > > I don't want to offend Laszlo, and I'm probably doing him wrong. > > I guess you TUs know this anyway, but let me say it anyhow. > > Trusted User doesn't mean, he likes Arch Linux - I like it, too -, he > likes to contribute to Arch Linux and to the community. Trusted User > means, that this user is completely trustworthy and that this user can > be completely trusted especially in security-related stuff. There are > so many doubts about Laszlo, that I don't think, that he is really > trustworthy. I, too, have my doubts about it. And keep in mind, that > not only other TUs but also every other normal user must trust a TU. > I've tried to clean some doubts, you can read back. I think it's normal in the descussion period, if something is not clear, we speak about it. Feel free to ask me, if you have got doubts. > The task of a TU is not to maintain a few - maybe 300 - packages in > AUR. This can do every user. Writing documentations in the Wiki can > also be done by every normal user. And every normal user can help other > people in the forums. > > Btw., I don't know, why someone needs to maintain or at least > contribute 300 packages in or to AUR. Most of them - except of about 2 > or 3 - are vim plugins anyway. I only maintain a few packages I need > myself, so that I can test them, before I upload them to AUR. I don't > think, that I could do it with 300 packages. > I can't do it with 300 packages really, I discussed it. I've done the reassessment. Well I accept the opinion from Xyne, It's not a bad thing to contribute packages, even if the user will disown that, because somebody can continue to maintain it, and you can reach those now too from AUR. > > The task of a TU is especially maintaining and compiling packages in > the community binary repository and to do administrative and security > related stuff in the AUR like orphaning packages etc. A TU needs to be > able to write working and trustworthy PKGBUILDs, and a TU needs some > more than only basic scripting skills, because some applications need > PKGBUILDs which are not quite trivial, the people - every Arch Linux > user - rely on and trust the binary repositories in terms of security > and stability. I don't see this with Laszlo. > > Particularly see the symlink thing in his PKGBUILD for the library. If > he was a Gentoo user for more than a year - I was one for about 6 years > -, he should know, that a library doesn't have to be symlinked to keep > or get reverse dependencies compatible to updated libraries. See > revdep-rebuild, which every Gentoo user knows only too well. Symlinking > a library can only be a quick and dirty workaround locally on one PC > until the reverse depedency is rebuilt or fixed. If such a symlink is > needed by another package, than he should file a feature request to > upstream. So this shows me, that Laszlo doesn't have enough scripting > and packaging skills, at least not enough to be able to build and > maintain packages in a semi-official binary repository, which every > user trusts. You can ask Corrado/bardo in this matter, I've worked with him together on gcc-avr packages, and it wasn't quite trivial/simple to keep it in updated format. We worked on it more days. I adopted some unclean packages that lasted me so much hours to fix, because they weren't so trivial for me. E.g. packages with kde3/kde4/qt3/qt4 compatibility problem, or cross-compiling packages with cross-toolchain. Yeah I've used revdep-rebuild while sleeping or working on other machine, because it was a long operation by me ;) > > I also read his comment in the forums, which Xyne posted here. > > Well the "Welcome to the forum" can be seen friendly. But then he > writes "We must realize whether...", and just repeats, what Allan has > already written. For me it sounds as he feels like already being a > developer, or that he wants to presume to be one. I don't know Laszlo's > intention, and I can do him wrong, but somehow it looks like craving > for recognition, there are at least doubts. > > So I don't know, if I could trust him enough. Okay, in this concrete example it wasn't sure for me he uses a good mirror, it could cause the issue too, that was my plus idea. I don't feel really that, I'm a developer. I don't like Role-playing game :) > > I'd suggest, not to make him a TU. I think there are enough things, he > can do for Arch Linux and the community without being a TU. If he will > prove beyond doubt in the future, that his attitude is good, his > scripting and packaging skills are even better, and he is really > trustworthy, then this can be discussed again and it can be voted again > about making him a TU, but not too early. I think, there's no hurry. > > Heiko > Thank you the reply. Best Regards, Laszlo Papp
