Jim
You wrote:
“ Genesis
13: 18 does not say “from place to place”. Rather, Genesis
13: 18 simply says Y)HL, meaning “to move one’s tent””
Was is your
authoritative source? I have several times now quoted
authoritative
sources and the interpretation of at least two Bible commentaries including
Adam
Clarke's.
“Abram
removed his tent - Continued to travel and pitch in different places,
till at last he fixed his tent in the plain, or by the oak, of Mamre,
“
You are the man
who claims camels die in Hebron because it's too cold in the winter. I think
it is understandable if I ask for documentation.
You haven't
responded to the commentaries at this point.
You wrote:
'On the contrary, an essential part of my theory of the case is that Abraham
d-i-d indeed “obey God's command to walk the land” (and, for that matter,
Abraham obeys all other divine commandments as well).“The minute Lot was
reduced to living in a cave, Abraham was off like a flash to far-off GRR.”
The order was given in Genesis 13:17? Isaac was born about 20 years later.
This is what you call obedience? Would your mother have let you wait 20 years
to carry out the trash? . You wrote: “Abraham could only perfect his claim
to all of Canaan, and have Sarah bear Isaac, by obeying the divine
commandment of Genesis 13: 17 by walking all the long way up north to
GRR/Galilee and interacting with Abimelek.”
What does “perfect his claim to all Canaan”..mean? Did Abraham have to
practice? Was there some sort of ritualhe couldn't get straight for two
decades? Please give us a coherent explanation of “perfecting his claim” and
why it it necessary to go north in order for Sarah to get pregnant. That also
puzzle me.Why are you obsessed with Lot who was never promised Canaan and knew
it?What is this fantasy of a "provisional claim" you say Lot had on Canaan?
Where is the verse? Any verse...even half a verse...And what of poor Eliezer
of Damascus and Ishmael who had more than a "provisional claim"...the kid was
HEIR apparentand ended up in the desert. You give Lot supremacy over Ishmael
which makes no sense at all.Yet you say the story of Abraham's journeys around
Canaan in the Dead Sea Scrolls is "creative fantasy". You repeatedly mention
Abimelech, let's review the story.
You claim the Abimelech of Abraham is the same as the Abi Milku of the Amarna
letters who was a mayor of Tyre appointed by Akhenaten You claim the
similarity in names, and the fact Abi Milku experienced “water problems” as you
put is your "proof" they were one and the same.
Just as a refresher, you have also claimed Genesis 14 is a description of
events in the Amarna age, specifically when King Suppiluliumas conquers
Kadesh...You claim it was King Suppi who was one of the"four against five" who
kidnapped Lot.
Ok, Some facts.
Tyre was, of course, an island city with no connection to the main land until
Alexander the Great built the causeway. The encyclopedia Britannica says
that Tyre was “without water or vegetation” until Alexander.
Abi Milku ruled the city of Tyre but not the coastal towns as they had
they're own mayors.
You would then have us believe Abraham took a boat to Tyre along with his
cattle and got into some dispute over some nonexistent wells on the island,
isn't that correct?
Next: Tyre depended on Ishu for both its water and timber for heat and
cooking to be brought in by boats. Ushu also provide land for burials.
When Zimredda captured Ushu he cut off Tyre's supply of water and timber.This
is what Abi Milku is complaining about in the Amarna letters, not wells as you
claim, but not being allowed to get water from the mainland. He wrote in EA 154:
“Moreover, since the departure of the troops of the king, my lord, from me,
the ruler of Siduna does not allow me or my people to go to land to fetch wood
or to fetch water for drinking.”
This was Abi Milku's “water problem” which was in no way similar to the
incidents between Abimelech and Abraham...nor would any one who knows history
have linked the two. Abraham could not have interacted from the mainland over
water with a ruler of an island.
Makes zero sense...
But let's continue. You claim Lot was rescued by Abraham in year 14 of
Akhenaten.
You then claim Abraham spends at least 12 years in Hebron where 'nothing
happens" until Lot is in a cave and Abraham goes to Abimilech.
Well, I think everyone can see this one coming as easy as ABC
A. Lot's is rescue takes place before the birth of Ishmael (the forgotten
man in your theory) your year 14 of Akhenaten . About this same time Abi Milku
is having “water problems”according to the Amarna Letters.
B. Isaac is born about 15 years after Lot's rescue and Abraham zooms to
interact with Abimelech” according to you.
Only problem is, the Amarna age was only but about 20 years long and
scholars believe Abi Milku was likely murdered before the death of Akhenaten
as his letters abruptly cease.
By your scenario Abraham rushes up to a man who has been dead at least 10
years. The Amarna age is over and not only is King Akhenaten dead by now,
but so it King Tut and King Suppiluliumas.
To make your “controversial theory” Lot's rescue, and Isaac's birth must
all take place within a couple of years, no time for Ishmael, ...so Abraham
can interact with a dead man about wells on an island with no water at all.
Jim, it's beyond logic how you came up with this theory.
You cannot shoehorn two events separated by at least 15 years i.e Lot's
rescue and Isaac's birth into an Armana age that was almost over by the time
Abi Milku had his “water problems”.
To say you have a credibility problem is an understatement. .
Rob Acosta
From: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 09:30:02 -0400
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Genesis 13:18 Appositional Phrase vs. Adjectival Phrase
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Rob: 1. You wrote: “I stated , based on the works of others that13:18 means
‘So Abraham moved his tents from place to place, then settled in Hebron’….”
Genesis 13: 18 does not say “from place to place”. Rather, Genesis 13: 18
simply says Y)HL, meaning “to move one’s tent”. Abram went down the mountain
after hearing YHWH’s words and promptly moved, without further ado, to the
Patriarchs’ XBRWN. That’s what the Biblical text says, and that’s what it
means. 2. You wrote: “You claim Abraham did not actually obey God's command
to walk the land.” On the contrary, an essential part of my theory of the case
is that Abraham d-i-d indeed “obey God's command to walk the land” (and, for
that matter, Abraham obeys all other divine commandments as well). The minute
Lot was reduced to living in a cave, Abraham was off like a flash to far-off
GRR. Abraham could only perfect his claim to all of Canaan, and have Sarah
bear Isaac, by obeying the divine commandment of Genesis 13: 17 by walking all
the long way up north to GRR/Galilee and interacting with Abimelek. 3. The
Genesis Apocryphon was composed well over a thousand years after the
composition of the truly ancient Patriarchal narratives, and is an imaginative
commentary. By that time, Biblical analysts were relying on the post-exilic
work of II Chronicles 14: 13-14 to think that the Patriarchs’ GRR was located
in southwest Judah. On that southern Hebrew theory of the case, Genesis did
not appear to show Abraham as honoring the divine commandment of Genesis 13: 17
to walk the length of Canaan, and so a grand trip around the known world was
dreamed up, having no Biblical basis whatsoever. Analysts today teach that
after splitting from Lot, Abraham never went north of Bethel the rest of his
long life, which is just as wrong as the Genesis Apocryphon dreaming up a
worldwide journey for Abram. Based on item #80 of the mid-15th century BCE
Thutmose III list of places in Canaan, and Amarna Letter EA 256, and the
Akkadian word for “rolling”, GRR is the Late Bronze Age rendering of Galilee,
which only after the Bronze Age came to be rendered as GLL or GLYL, in all
cases referring to the “rolling” hills of Galilee. On that historical basis,
we can see that Abraham did indeed obey the divine commandment at Genesis 13:
17 in full. 4. If you’re interested in how today’s leading Genesis scholar
explains Abraham’s move to GRR, here it is: “This is an astonishing episode.
It seems incredible that Abraham should make the same dreadful mistake again:
visiting a foreign country, he passes his wife off as his sister. …Indeed,
when challenged by Abimelek, he resorts to lying, claiming he described Sarah
as his sister wherever they went. …Thus, this incident makes us realize that
Abraham is not such a saint as we might have concluded from chap. 18….” Gordon
Wenham, “Genesis 16-50” (1994), at p. 75. So when scripture shows Abraham as
righteously obeying the divine commandment of Genesis 13: 17 by moving to GRR
and interacting with Abimelek, modern analysts characterize that, believe it or
not, as being a “dreadful mistake” on Abraham’s part. Modern analysts in fact
have no idea whatsoever why Abraham moves to GRR the minute Lot is reduced to
living in a cave. Incredibly, they write it off as being “an astonishing
episode” that is a “dreadful mistake”, when in fact the reality is exactly the
opposite, as Abraham is consistently righteous to a fault. 5. Note also that
Abram never elbowed Lot aside, though Abram had the power to do so. Abram did
not use his 318 armed men at Genesis 14: 14 to push Lot out of Canaan. When
Lot was taken as a hostage, Abram did not leave Lot to his fate, but rather
risked Abram’s own life to make a daring rescue of Lot. And when YHWH tells
Abraham of YHWH’s plan to destroy iniquitous Sodom, Abraham goes out of his way
(in the second half of chapter 18 of Genesis, where Prof. Wenham sees Abraham
as acting like “a saint”) to make sure that Sodom will not be destroyed if as
few as 10 innocent people are living there, with Abraham of course knowing that
Lot and Lot’s family were living in Sodom. Abraham by this point knows that
Sarah will not bear Isaac, and Abraham will not be able to claim all of Canaan,
until and unless Lot’s provisional claim to the northern two-thirds of Canaan
is eliminated. But Abraham admirably is unwilling to push Lot aside himself
and, rather, properly waits until YHWH determines that Lot’s lack of
affirmative opposition to Sodom’s turn to the dark side after chapter 14 of
Genesis means that Lot has forfeited any and all claim to Canaan. Lot is
reduced to living in a cave by divine action, Abraham then immediately moves to
GRR, and almost immediately Sarah gets pregnant with Isaac. That’s all in the
Biblical text, with no creative, fanciful commentary being needed. Nor is that
grand sequence a “dreadful mistake”! The reason why post-exilic and all
subsequent analysts have failed to see this is because they rely on II
Chronicles as to its post-exilic ultra-southerly retroactive re-interpretation
of the geographical locations of GRR and XCCN TMR, instead of looking to Bronze
Age sources for the historical meaning of those key geographical terms that in
fact refer to places way up north. Jim StinehartEvanston, Illinois
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