you are right!
BTW did you try http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/Botsinc for your kids and
also Plop (but that this is really for the total fun).
You should have a look at Dolphin this is even slicker :)
Stef
On 14 août 06, at 07:46, christo wrote:
Hi All,
I'm VERY new to Smalltalk and I'm currently cherishing my first
impressions of Squeak (because they are informative not because
they are positive) and further I am paid to write Java at work.
With that out of the way I'd like to agree with Keith Hodges here.
"Its all down to marketing marketing and more marketing."
Very true. It's something I've observed many brilliant programmers
utterly fail to grasp.
For those of you who fail likewise this try this exercise: Imagine
your first experience of something new. Imagine you can't stand the
smell of it. You have such a visceral response to it that you
really don't want to consider any other worthy attributes of it.
The only thing that can occupy your mind is that it stinks and you
want to throw up and please can someone just get it away from you.
Now imagine something that has not been expertly marketed and
designed (though not necessarily commercially marketed and
designed). To the vast majority of people (perhaps not people like
you and perhaps not rightly) this new thing smells just like the
thing you imagined. Until that marketing happens (either "virally"
through personal recommendation or through more traditional means)
that thing will stink for anyone else who goes near it.
I hope this metaphor isn't too way out but for me it captures the
problem with Squeak (and other good technical things that have not
had their due attention in the world). I know squeak isn't
Smalltalk but I ultimately tried Squeak because I wanted to teach
my kids programming and learn a nice language myself. So far so
good but I decided to carefully capture some of my initial
impressions. Squeak definitely lacks any kind of capable graphic
design or usability sense. It's not a criticism because of course I
can try to help fix it etc etc. But it is intended to serve as an
explanation to those who just can't imagine why others wouldn't
fall instantly in love with it.
I've lumped visual design and marketing together in this discussion
which is usually an oversimplification, but I think it contrasts
with the purist engineering aspect.
The name "Smalltalk" also smells by the way. Java used to smell a
bit because it sounds kinda funky and unprofessional on first
hearing to a middle manager, but over time this reaction has been
marketed away. "Smalltalk" sounds to those folk like something
feeble, uncapable. It can be overcome but only with attention paid
to promotion.
Marketing forms preconceptions and "prejudices". Lack of marketing
makes things seem suspect and unworthy in comparison to those
things that get good press (however unworthily).
I do intend to follow advice I've received from professional
Smalltalk developers and get Cincom's IDE but I don't think that's
going to be part of my project to teach my kids to program.
You should have a look at Dolphin this is even slicker :)
Feedback encouraged.
Regards,
Chris.
--
Chris Mountford
"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
But, in practice, there is." -- Jan L. A. van de Snepscheut
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