A couple of notes about the signal detection markings. I'll assume that Grant is correct, and this is what the stencil is - I haven't seen it.
- Most in-street detection loops for autos have been able to detect bikes for quite a while if they are tuned properly. However, a bike must be positioned at the correct location to get picked up - this is what the stencil indicates. There was a stencil over a detection loop on northbound Seminole at PD for years, but it may be worn off now. - As above, as far as I know, the loops can't tell the difference between a car and a bike - they will pick up anything metallic above them. So putting loops at locations like the HAWK on Mifflin won't work well as every car that comes along will trigger the signal. - It is likely that the loop at Parr has been there for a while, but generally only picks up cars unless a cyclist knows exactly where to position. The signal timing is probably set primarily for cars, so will seem short for bikes. It is great that the city is beginning to mark where cyclists should position to trigger signals that have detection loops - there are likely dozens of these around the city. What I would really like to see, is the installation of video detection that can differentiate between autos, cyclists and pedestrians and can then adjust signal timing appropriately. These systems are in widespread use in some cities, but I am not aware of them being used anywhere in Madison. Something like this would work well at the Mifflin HAWK. More info about such systems here: http://www.modot.org/stlouis/links/signalcameras.htm. Kevin -- *Kevin [email protected] <[email protected]>* ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Grant Foster <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2013 13:29:42 -0600 Subject: Re: [Bikies] New bike stencil: Vilas at S. Park It turns out that this is what the markings were for on Parr St. The new stencils were up today and positioning my bike over one of them worked to trigger the light. Happy day:) The green signal duration is still quite short and may be worth reevaluating for any traffic engineers on the list. I'm pretty quick off the line and accelerate quickly and still can't quite make it across before it turns red. I think this will be a struggle for others and leaves a real potential for danger at this intersection. Grant On Sat, Nov 9, 2013 at 7:40 AM, Grant Foster <[email protected]> wrote: > Parr/Park desperately needs this. Parr is the logical route from W. Shore > or S. Shore to Fish or Park southbound. This means all traffic coming from > the Eastside/John Nolen (through Brittingham). There's not even a button > for PEDs on the north side of Parr, so a cyclist has to ride up Parr, turn > into the crosswalk to cross Parr, onto the sidewalk by Barriques, push the > button, then back down the sidewalk, across the crosswalk and get yourself > situated pointing west to wait for the 3 seconds of green. Except, you > might not even get a green, but only a ped walk light back at the Barriques > corner while northbound traffic off of Fish starts moving. So then you get > to try and hustle back over there and cross at that crosswalk (hopefully > there's no traffic coming from Fish onto Parr). After all that, you find > yourself on the sidewalk on the east side of Fish and have to look for a > chance (good luck) to get back on the road heading south. > > I did see some markings at this intersection last week. Could this be what > they're for (pretty please)? > On Nov 8, 2013 11:38 PM, "Paul T. O'Leary" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> On 2013/11/08 23:06, Steve Arnold wrote: >> >>> On 11/8/2013 5:19 PM, Mitchell Nussbaum wrote: >>> >>>> Riding to work this morning, I noticed a new stencil on the Vilas Ave. >>>> pavement, right before it crosses Park St. It doesn't look like a sharrow. >>>> Could it be a marker to show cyclists where to go to activate a green >>>> light? If so, I'd like to thank whoever is responsible; I've wanted >>>> something like that for a long time at that intersection. >>>> >>> >>> Was it the Bicycle Detector pavement marking? >>> http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/htm/2009/part9/fig9c_07_longdesc.htm (MUTCD) >>> >>> There needs to be more education about this symbol. I think few >>> bicyclists are aware of its meaning. >>> (MUTCD: "A symbol (see Figure 9C-7) may be placed on the pavement >>> indicating the optimum position for a bicyclist to actuate the signal.") >>> >> One (well, two) of these detectors would be perfect for the HAWK signal >> at N. Blair / E. Mifflin. As it is now, it's a flashy but mostly useless >> and confusing gadget. These detectors would make it actually useful to >> bicyclists, by eliminating the abysmally stupid idea of going to the CURB >> (the WORST place for a bicyclist to be at that intersection) to activate it. >> >> -- >> Paul T. O'Leary >> Chronic Nuisance >> Madison, WI USA >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Bikies mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.danenet.org/listinfo.cgi/bikies-danenet.org >> >
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