Bounce tracking mitigations are now rolling out to 100% stable starting
today (in cases where 3P cookies are blocked).

On Mon, Sep 25, 2023 at 11:00 AM Ben Kelly <wanderv...@chromium.org> wrote:

> FYI, we are rolling out bounce tracking mitigations to stable 10% today.
> (Again, this only impacts users who are blocking 3P cookies.)  This
> intermediate rollout step was added in order to investigate some
> regressions that showed up in the 1% stable data.
>
> On Thu, Sep 7, 2023 at 12:29 PM Ben Kelly <wanderv...@chromium.org> wrote:
>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> FYI, bounce tracking mitigations are rolling out to stable 1% as of today.
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 5, 2023 at 12:09 PM Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> LGTM3
>>>
>>> On Tue, Sep 5, 2023 at 6:56 AM Ben Kelly <wanderv...@chromium.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ping for last LGTM or more feedback.  We were hoping to be able to
>>>> collect some stable data before TPAC, if possible.
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 8:45 AM Yoav Weiss <yoavwe...@chromium.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> LGTM2
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Aug 29, 2023 at 5:44 PM Ben Kelly <wanderv...@chromium.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 29, 2023 at 1:40 AM Yoav Weiss <yoavwe...@chromium.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree that WPT infrastructure shouldn't be a blocker when we're
>>>>>>> following other browsers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have y'all tested the mitigation with commonly used
>>>>>>> authentication/payment flows, to make sure it doesn't break them?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We have been dogfooding and not run into any issues with auth/payment
>>>>>> flows.  We are also collecting UKM metrics on sites deleted.  I've sent 
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> a private email with that information.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The UKM is predominantly advertising, tracking, etc.  There are a
>>>>>> smattering of auth/ecommerce/etc, but at lower volumes.  The auth issue 
>>>>>> we
>>>>>> believe may be related to automatic login scenarios in enterprises (issue
>>>>>> 36 <https://github.com/privacycg/nav-tracking-mitigations/issues/36>),
>>>>>> which can be largely addressed with enterprise policies.  We also
>>>>>> integrated webauthn security key taps as interactions in M117 to reduce
>>>>>> authentication false positives.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Overall, however, we believe that since we only take action when 3P
>>>>>> cookies are blocked, breakage should be limited.  The 3P cookie default 
>>>>>> has
>>>>>> not changed yet, so most users will not be affected.  In addition,
>>>>>> chromeguard, enterprise policies and other mechanisms can be used to add
>>>>>> cookie exceptions which bounce tracking mitigations will honor.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ultimately, many sites will need to adapt to a new normal when the 3P
>>>>>> cookie setting default changes.  That will need to include that bounce
>>>>>> tracking is not an acceptable replacement.  We would like to ship bounce
>>>>>> tracking mitigations gated on 3P cookie permissions so that when sites
>>>>>> perform 3P cookie deprecation testing they see the new bounce tracking
>>>>>> behavior as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for outlining your motivations! Going ahead with this change
>>>>> before the 3P cookie deprecation but 3P cookie blocking makes perfect 
>>>>> sense!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 28, 2023 at 11:08 PM Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> LGTM1 to ship, as long as we fast follow with doing the work to
>>>>>>>> define
>>>>>>>> and ship webdriver extensions in order to make this testable in WPT.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> (I don't think your team should be blocked on shipping because
>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>> browsers who already shipped the feature didn't do that work.)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 8/21/23 3:44 PM, Christian Biesinger wrote:
>>>>>>>> > On Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 3:25 PM Ben Kelly <
>>>>>>>> wanderv...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> On Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 11:38 AM Mike Taylor <
>>>>>>>> miketa...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>> On 8/21/23 11:09 AM, Ben Kelly wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> On Sun, Aug 20, 2023 at 11:27 PM Yoav Weiss <
>>>>>>>> yoavwe...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>>> Thanks for working on this important problem!
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> On Thu, Aug 17, 2023 at 9:28 PM Ben Kelly <
>>>>>>>> wanderv...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>>>> Sorry, it seems I left off the signals section of the
>>>>>>>> template:
>>>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>> Firefox: No signal (
>>>>>>>> https://github.com/mozilla/standards-positions/issues/835)
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> Firefox folks seem tentatively supportive, but have WPT
>>>>>>>> questions. Can you address them?
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> I'm checking without our WPT folks to try to understand what
>>>>>>>> mozilla is suggesting.  I'm not familiar with web-driver functions at 
>>>>>>>> all,
>>>>>>>> so not quite sure yet how feasible this is.
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> My read on bvandersloot's comment is that he's asking for a
>>>>>>>> less generic version
>>>>>>>> https://github.com/web-platform-tests/wpt/issues/17489 to make
>>>>>>>> this testable (which you've already linked below). Exposing endpoints 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> advancing time seems to have more use cases than bounce 
>>>>>>>> tracking-specific
>>>>>>>> webdriver endpoints, IMHO - but that's a discussion that should 
>>>>>>>> probably
>>>>>>>> happen in the relevant WG.
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> See https://github.com/web-platform-tests/rfcs for the process
>>>>>>>> to propose extending the testdriver.js API to expose... but I think 
>>>>>>>> you'll
>>>>>>>> want to get the relevant concepts added to the webdriver spec first 
>>>>>>>> (seems
>>>>>>>> possible, if Mozilla if supportive). The other option would be to 
>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>> similar to FedCM by adding webdriver extension commands (see spec PR 
>>>>>>>> here:
>>>>>>>> https://github.com/fedidcg/FedCM/pull/465/files).
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> I personally wouldn't recommend blocking on this work, but it
>>>>>>>> seems useful for someone to pursue as good first bugs for folks 
>>>>>>>> interested
>>>>>>>> in standards and WPT internals. Note that additions to WebDriver now
>>>>>>>> require going through the Intent process (great news for folks 
>>>>>>>> interested
>>>>>>>> in learning this process, presumably they exist!).
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Andrew Williams also helpfully pointed out a bunch of code
>>>>>>>> source references to me for this.  I filed crbug.com/1474656 to do
>>>>>>>> this work.
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> I think this is definitely something we will do, but it may take
>>>>>>>> a milestone or two to get it done.  In particular, I'm unsure if there 
>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>> be pushback to modifying the web-driver functions for a bounce tracking
>>>>>>>> mitigations-specific feature.
>>>>>>>> > Lots of specs define webdriver extensions, that should not be a
>>>>>>>> problem. E.g.:
>>>>>>>> > https://fedidcg.github.io/FedCM/#automation
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> https://w3c.github.io/secure-payment-confirmation/#sctn-automation
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> https://w3c.github.io/webauthn/#sctn-automation-virtual-authenticators
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Note that you have to implement the commands twice, once for
>>>>>>>> Chrome's
>>>>>>>> > bots and once for upstream wpt.fyi and general UA automation uses.
>>>>>>>> > Chrome's impl does not really use webdriver, it usually just
>>>>>>>> calls a
>>>>>>>> > function on internals (e.g.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/c/chromium/src/+/4740672/6/third_party/blink/web_tests/resources/testdriver-vendor.js
>>>>>>>> )
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > The second impl is in Chromedriver, likely using CDP, e.g.:
>>>>>>>> > https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/c/chromium/src/+/4281897
>>>>>>>> > plus
>>>>>>>> > https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/c/chromium/src/+/4402971
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Christian
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >> I don't think we want to take on the general purpose clock
>>>>>>>> modification change to web-driver, though.  That seems like a much 
>>>>>>>> larger
>>>>>>>> scope.
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>> Webkit: No signal (
>>>>>>>> https://github.com/WebKit/standards-positions/issues/214)
>>>>>>>> >>>>> Web developers: No signals
>>>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Aug 17, 2023 at 10:22 AM Ben Kelly <
>>>>>>>> wanderv...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Contact emails
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> wanderv...@chromium.org, b...@chromium.org,
>>>>>>>> rtarp...@chromium.org, j...@chromium.org
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Explainer
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://github.com/privacycg/nav-tracking-mitigations/blob/main/bounce-tracking-explainer.md
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Specification
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://privacycg.github.io/nav-tracking-mitigations/#bounce-tracking-mitigations
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Summary
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> This feature mitigates bounce tracking on the web.  It works
>>>>>>>> by deleting state from sites that access storage during a redirect 
>>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>>> user has never directly interacted with.  See the specification for 
>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>> details.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Blink component
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Privacy>NavTracking
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> TAG review
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> https://github.com/w3ctag/design-reviews/issues/862
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> TAG review status
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Issues addressed
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Risks
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> The main risk is that we will incorrectly delete state for a
>>>>>>>> site that the user needs to continue functioning.  Our approach 
>>>>>>>> attempts to
>>>>>>>> address this with a number of signals:
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> If a user has interacted with the site within the last 45
>>>>>>>> days, we will not delete its state.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We are adding successful webauthn key assertions as another
>>>>>>>> "interaction" source in M117 to address SSO use cases that only require
>>>>>>>> security taps to stay logged in.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We only delete state if the potential tracking site is not
>>>>>>>> permitted as a 3P cookie.  This allows users and enterprises to grant
>>>>>>>> permission to maintain state on these sites through existing 
>>>>>>>> mechanisms.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We have documented some known use cases at-risk.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> In particular, since 3P cookies are default allowed today,
>>>>>>>> this feature will only have an immediate impact on users that have 
>>>>>>>> opted
>>>>>>>> into 3P cookie blocking or incognito where 3P cookies are blocked by
>>>>>>>> default.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Ergonomics
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Minimal ergonomic risk.  There are no direct APIs to call
>>>>>>>> here.  We are deleting state for sites behind the scenes.  We do not 
>>>>>>>> delete
>>>>>>>> state for sites that are currently open.  We have devtools 
>>>>>>>> enhancements to
>>>>>>>> help developers understand the process.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Activation
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> No activation risk.  There is nothing to polyfill.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Security
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> This feature does incrementally worsen existing XS-Leaks in
>>>>>>>> the browser by exposing an additional bit of information.  Attackers 
>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>> learn if a user has interacted with a site within the last 45 days if 
>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>> are able to trigger a stateful bounce on the target site and execute a
>>>>>>>> XS-Leak attack to detect the existence of cookies or state on the site.
>>>>>>>> Since bounce tracking mitigations are only enforced when 3P cookies are
>>>>>>>> blocked, however, the XS-Leak must use navigations and not subresource
>>>>>>>> attacks.
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> Does that mean that any exposed navigation bounce on a
>>>>>>>> sensitive site becomes a history leak? Or do other conditions apply 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> would make this a rare occurrence?
>>>>>>>> >>>> If it's the former, how do other browsers' mitigation
>>>>>>>> techniques deal with this?
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> I don't think it's equivalent to a full history leak on its
>>>>>>>> own.  In order to get the extra leaked bit of "was interacted with in 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> last 45 days", the site must already have a XS-leak allowing an 
>>>>>>>> attacker to
>>>>>>>> detect the existence of cookies or state on the site.  Typically 
>>>>>>>> cookies or
>>>>>>>> state are already going to indicate some user activity (interaction).  
>>>>>>>> So
>>>>>>>> the additional bit, while strictly a worsening of the situation, is
>>>>>>>> relatively minor compared to what is available from the prerequisite 
>>>>>>>> attack.
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>> Again, we'd like to work on closing the underlying XS-leak that
>>>>>>>> allows attackers to detect cookies/state in the future.  Fixing forward
>>>>>>>> here is preferable since trying to fix just the interaction bit in 
>>>>>>>> bounce
>>>>>>>> tracking mitigations itself would likely force the introduction of some
>>>>>>>> kind of allow/block list which has larger negative impacts (as 
>>>>>>>> discussed in
>>>>>>>> the explainer alternatives).
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We feel the best solution to this problem is to invest in
>>>>>>>> fixing navigation-based XS-Leaks.  The additional bit of interaction
>>>>>>>> information leaked in the meantime is not ideal, but it has limited 
>>>>>>>> utility
>>>>>>>> if an attacker can already tell if there is state on the target site.  
>>>>>>>> We
>>>>>>>> are interested in collaborating with the security team to help address 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> underlying XS-Leak.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> WebView application risks
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We are purposely excluding WebView from this launch so we
>>>>>>>> can evaluate impact to that platform separately.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Debuggability
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We issue devtool "issues" when a site may potentially be
>>>>>>>> deleted as a bounce tracking.  In addition, we have a devtools 
>>>>>>>> application
>>>>>>>> panel to force the bounce tracking algorithm to run immediately.  See 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> screenshots in this blog post.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Will this feature be supported on all six Blink platforms
>>>>>>>> (Windows, Mac, Linux, Chrome OS, Android, and Android WebView)?
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> All except WebView.  We would like to evaluate the impact to
>>>>>>>> WebView in a separate launch.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Is this feature fully tested by web-platform-tests?
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> No, unfortunately.  Since this feature runs off of a long
>>>>>>>> duration timer we cannot construct a WPT test case.  We need wpt#17489 
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> be fixed in order to correct this.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Flag name
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> DIPS
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Requires code in //chrome?
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Yes.  We must integrate with features like the chrome
>>>>>>>> sign-in manager, TabHelper, etc.  We are, however, actively working to 
>>>>>>>> move
>>>>>>>> other code into the content// layer.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Tracking bug
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=1360489
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Measurement
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We are measuring UKM for sites that have state deleted by
>>>>>>>> bounce tracking mitigations.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Availability expectation
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Our initial MVP implementation is launching to all platforms
>>>>>>>> with the exception of WebView.  In addition, bounce tracking 
>>>>>>>> mitigations
>>>>>>>> are only enforced in situations where the tracking domain is not 
>>>>>>>> permitted
>>>>>>>> as a 3P cookie.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Adoption expectation
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> There is no specific API to adopt for this effort, but we
>>>>>>>> only enforce the bounce tracking mitigations when 3P cookies are 
>>>>>>>> blocked.
>>>>>>>> Therefore we expect it to have a greater impact as 3P cookie blocking
>>>>>>>> becomes more common in the future.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Adoption plan
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> N/A
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Non-OSS dependencies
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> None
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Sample links
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> https://bounce-tracking-demo.glitch.me/
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Estimated milestones
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Gradual rollout during M116.  Webauthn interaction support
>>>>>>>> will take effect in M117.
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Anticipated spec changes
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> We have written a monkey-patch spec here:
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://privacycg.github.io/nav-tracking-mitigations/#bounce-tracking-mitigations
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5705149616488448
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>> Links to previous Intent discussions
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAK7rkMi_7z0-yeTbBiE43V5SD1ri4jSVxrkR8Gs%3DD0NRoRKivA%40mail.gmail.com
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/blink-dev/c/vyXWn1W1daA/m/tL3f1_WbAwAJ
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
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