On Tue, 3 Sep 2019 10:29:51 -0700 Dave Taht <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 3, 2019 at 8:57 AM Rich Brown <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > On Sep 3, 2019, at 11:22 AM, [email protected] wrote: > > > > > > The coffee shop tests were fun, but I(we) needed more rigor when doing > > > them. What I'd typically do is go in, > > > get on the wifi, start 6 minutes worth of tests, get in line, get > > > coffee... > > > > OK. I'll bite. What "six minutes of tests" do you queue up? What do you > > record? > > Still working out what the "right thing" would be. The ecn syn failure > thing was new (didn't know OSX had that stat), getting some caps, > seeing if ipv6 was available, all seem like good ideas, in addition to > bloat protection. > > the most recent script was this - (the data is in my blog-cerowrt repo > on github, also). > > We could turn this into a batch file and try to get more rigorous > about also getting a packet cap. > > Is there a decent android or IOS tool yet? > > #!/bin/sh > > T="Los_Gatos_Starbucks" > F="flent -x -H flent-fremont.bufferbloat.net -t $T" > > $F --te=download_streams=4 tcp_ndown > $F --te=upload_streams=4 --socket-stats tcp_nup > # $F --te=upload_streams=4 tcp_2up_square # not useful enough > $F rrul > $F rrul_be > > > > And how do you broach the subject with the owner? Something like... > > Carefully. The owners are always ready to take a complement or > complaint, and, so long as you catch 'em when > not too busy are usually pretty social in general. > > In many cases they share the wifi with their credit card reader and > when I say that fixing bufferbloat helps, > their eyes light up. That was a specific problem that at least one had > - demonstrable - I saw it take forever > to clear a transaction (and the bloat was 2+ seconds long at the time > - NOT triggered by me) once... he had a synology router, and "applying > QoS" "just worked", and we did other things like reposition the > antenna, also. got me lunch > that did and he punched a whole bunch of holes in my "repeat business" > card.... > > However the employees usually lack the router's password and clue. > > IF we were to make this a thing (and it does invoke fond memories of > how we first spread wifi around the bay area > and then the world in the early 2000s - I was part of a group called > thirdbreak that generally lept across the counter to help a lot, back > in the days we were so eager to get out of the office and onto wifi > that we were mapping all the locations available - example: > http://www.wififreespot.com/ca.php from those days...), perhaps carry > a portable printer for the test output, biz cards, and so on for the > no-owner-present case. > > I recently hit on the idea of creating stickers - attached is the one > I'm using on my guitar... > > which is a bit too much over the top, I think, generally. > > but plan to give out 0.0.0.0/8 and 240.0.0.0/4 ones next time. > > They are cheap (I used stickermule) and with a cool logo, folk dig > adorning their laptops with them, in general. Still, > we've never found that logo/slogan for fixing bufferbloat - the word > is too long and too negative, though I thought > the inverted wifi logo we use on the cerowrt site a good start. "Better wifi". > > With more folk gathering data... > > Maybe (for example) we'd play off starbucks vs peets - attached is > starbucks (using google wifi) vs another coffeeshop, coffeecat - sigh. > but weirdly enough starbucks's packet cap - although very close to > what a fq_codel'd trace would look like, doesn't actually seem to be a > fq_codeled trace. Still puzzled, need to go back and try that spot > again. > > And I gotta say, it's *really good* to get out of the lab once in a > while and see people, and sometimes, actually fix something, trying a > different coffee shop every week. > > I guess, in the cases where the coffee doesn't become free, I could > deduct it as a business expense. :) > > > "Uh, I think I know why all those heads are popping up..." OR > > "This is a nice network you have here. It'd be a shame if something > > happened to it..." OR > > Oh, that's great! Goes with my costume, too. "Hey buddy, got an ipv6 address?" > > > "I know I look like [don't look like] a pointy-headed geek, but there's > > this thing called bufferbloat..." OR > > "Do you ever get complaints that your wifi is really slow?" > > I might also have an agenda in trying to see how much ipv6 is out > there, and the syn thing is bugging me, too. > So with a more organized set of tests, we could fan out to the coffee > shops of the world and forment another > wifi revolution and turn that world upside down! Who's with me!? There was a recent Wall Street Journal article that faster Internet doesn't mean anything. https://www.wsj.com/graphics/faster-internet-not-worth-it/ I just thought "faster Internet just exposes your existing Bufferbloat" _______________________________________________ Bloat mailing list [email protected] https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat
