Good question, Snorri. What do you mean Mark by derivative marks?
-bill On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 8:21 AM, Snorri Giorgetti < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > What do you mean by "derivative"? > > > > I think you confuse the specifications (2.0,…) with the (TM) Policies > > (this already happened to me to make this mistake! :) > > > > -Snorri > > > > *De :* Mark Cross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > *Envoyé :* mercredi 12 mars 2008 15:10 > > *À :* Snorri Giorgetti > *Cc :* Bill Washburn; [email protected] > *Objet :* Re: Trademarks: Problems with derivative Marks > > > > But I confirm what I have already said: "I/we have no views or plans about > the "derivative" TM" > > > Snorri / OIDF, > > ah, so what are you going to do if someone registers one? > > Cheers Mark > > > > On 12/03/2008, *Snorri Giorgetti* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Dear Mark, > > > > I speak for OIDE, and it does not therefore the responsibility of OIDF > > But I confirm what I have already said: "I/we have no views or plans about > the "derivative" TM" > > > > I strongly recommend you to find another "Business Model" as this concept > of TM licensed! > > > > I'm at your disposal to help you in UK and find better solutions for all… > > > > Cheers > > > > -Snorri > > > > *De :* Mark Cross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > *Envoyé :* mercredi 12 mars 2008 14:28 > *À :* Snorri Giorgetti > *Cc :* Bill Washburn; [email protected] > > > *Objet :* Re: Trademarks: Problems with derivative Marks > > > > > > On 12/03/2008, *Snorri Giorgetti* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Dear Mark, > > > > I'm very surprised by your affirmation with my name because, personally, I > have never had any projects related to the "Certification" and TM. > > > Sorry there Snorri. I thought Certification was part of the OIDF roadmap > from seeing that. > > > > The only PDF document online with the word "Certification" is here > http://www.openidsource.org/OpenID%20Source.JPG > > But I wrote it in June 2007, and it is no longer relevant! (but as a wiki, > I leave it online) And it was a thoughts about the trust reputation between > an OP and an RP to avoid phishing > > But I advise instead to read the draft of the Nat's team here: > http://myidproject.net/?OpenIDReputationService > > > I am going to spend some time digesting that > > > > But no relation to the Trademark! > > > > In Europe we have a position easy about the TM: > > The name "OpenID™" is now protected to avoid to be used for other plans > that the "OpenID Framework" exactly as FireFox is a browser and no a brand > of coffee ! ;-) (why not lol) > > Nothing more! > > > > I have much worked in 2007 on this question of TM and sorry but I'm > currently very tired to talk still about this, > > Now I would use my time on others important projects… (as local chapters > and convince large RPs) > > > > Concretely what do you want with your OpenID UK TM? = The Money ? :) > > > I have no idea at momment, it would be nice, but any revenue coming from > it has to "in the spirit" of Brad's guiding statement. > > I am just very nervous that things will happen that require sum financing. > Not having the resources to sort anything out, does not help the OpenID > Community? > > Do you have any views on how derivative Trademarks should be licensed? > > Cheers Mark > > > > "I promised to come soon visit your nice English countryside…" > > > > Cheers > > > > -Snorri > > > > *De :* Mark Cross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > *Envoyé :* mardi 11 mars 2008 23:45 > *À :* Bill Washburn > *Cc :* [email protected]; Snorri Giorgetti > *Objet :* Re: Trademarks: Problems with derivative Marks > > > > Bill, > > I know that Snorri was keen to pursue Certification - or was at one point, > I remember seeing a PDF on his web site, but I cannot find it now. > > Quite simply - how does certification occur without the generation of a > derivative of the OpenID logo Trademark? > > EG This site is only "OpenID v2 compatible logo" > > Now the issuer of that logo has an office to run, and I believe that > derivative logos that are trying to achieve the same thing - should look > after universally similar across the world, as Randy's logo does. This is > good for the Community and good for the end user. > > Broaching the question of "revenue for licensing" is in obvious > contradiction to the policy of being entirely free and of course that > precludes anything that is revenue generating including licensing fees or > royalties > > > So should no derivative Mark's should be licensed? > > I don't think this is practical - nor desirable for the Community. > > Assuming that the US OpenID Foundation considers it's actually a good idea > to issue derivative Trademarks, because it offers the Community and Users > great advantages eg Certification etc > > Then who is going to administer derivative Trademarks in each legal > jurisdiction? > > Honestly, I simply can't parse well the "situation" as you describe it. > Please just put your questions on the table directly. What are you > asserting and what do you aim to do as a result of those assertions? > > > Derivative Trademarks will be a huge factor in the uptake of OpenID in my > opinion. > > so to me this feels like a question that is an attempt to somehow get the > nose of the camel into the tent. > > > :-) I guess so. > > Now you/the US Foundation can take the view that you still cannot > understand where I am coming from, which is fair enough. Then I believe > that in the next couple of months the current Trademark holders will be > approached about derivative Marks: > > a) The Foundation provides direction and suggests a policy to the > Trademark holders globally, so everybody does something similar in a > coordinated fashion > > or > > b) We muddle along like we are doing now, which I personally think is a > bad option > > I am sorry if this email comes over badly, I am just frustrated that since > Nov 07, nothing on the Trademark front "appears" to have moved forwards and > I see brand management of OpenID as really crucial. > > What are you asserting and what do you aim to do as a result of those > assertions? > > > See dialog on the Legal mailing list? > > All the best, > > Mark > > On 11/03/2008, *Bill Washburn* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Mark, > > Thanks for your note. I have read and reread your email, specifically the > parts about: > > a) "How should the revenue for licensing be distributed - if a holder > wishes to?" > > and > > b) the "situation" and the follow-on question leave me with a sense of > real concern. > > Could you please clarify? Broaching the question of "revenue for > licensing" is in obvious contradiction to the policy of being entirely free > and of course that precludes anything that is revenue generating including > licensing fees or royalties, so to me this feels like a question that is an > attempt to somehow get the nose of the camel into the tent. Or are am I > missing something? > > Honestly, I simply can't parse well the "situation" as you describe it. > Please just put your questions on the table directly. What are you > asserting and what do you aim to do as a result of those assertions? > > Cordially, > -bill > > > > On Sat, Mar 8, 2008 at 10:34 AM, Mark Cross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > Dear Bill, > > Sorry for not writing sooner, I had to attend a family funeral this week > and have been Net less. > > With regards to our conversation two Fridays back my illustration is as > follows: > > As a Trademark holder - by accident because I needed to protect the > domain, I do see a lot of problems with derivative Marks. > > 1. The brand needs to be protected > 2. How should the revenue for licensing be distributed - if a holder > wishes to? > > *Situation:* > > Having got the Trademark I decided that given that absolutely no > provincial (local) Angel Investment network understands OpenID, I might as > well register a derivative mark to raise money through certification, to > fund both myself and further OpenID in the UK. > > Whilst as I the own the Mark I have no qualms about doings this, but I do > have an ethical dilemma that profit should be further split between, Brad, > Randy and the OpenID Foundation US/Europe/UK. > > *Question:* > > Would the board like to offer any advice on this to me as an individual, > and or suggest ideas that could be promoted to the other holders? > > Cheers Mark > > > > > > > > >
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