Terri, OK, I'd worked out where you were coming from on this and your message was good confirmation. I've decided to do it the other way round, as you do, from now on. I got used to suppressing prompts but then had to do it again if I ttook a file from a CF card.
Anyway, so far as I am concerned it's been a useful discussion, thanks. -- Carol [EMAIL PROTECTED] -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terri Pannett Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2006 4:29 AM To: Braillenote List Subject: Re: [Braillenote] Page Breaks Dear Carol, I usually import .brf files into KeyWord braille, edit them, and then export them to .brf files so a person who doesn't have a BN can read them using another notetaker. I have the kwb file and they have the .brf file. But if I know the person will or may open them using DBT Win on a PC, then I will take another step. I would open the .brf files using DBT Win and save them again as .brf. This is because .brf files created on the BN don't always open properly in DBT Win without using a trick I have devised to make DBT like the files. If you decide not to import the .brf files, you will always have to "review the options" when you open them. Also, when you close the file, you will be prompted to save it as a Keyword file. To suppress this prompt, press s. I get so tired of the "review options" prompt. That's why I import the files into KeyWord braille. I hope this isn't too confusing. Terri, Amateur Radio call sign KF6CA. Army MARS call sign AAT9PX, California ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol Pearson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'Braillenote List'" <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 1:48 PM Subject: RE: [Braillenote] Page Breaks : Terri, : : First, apologies for not checking the spelling of your name last time : around. I remembered after sending the message <SMILE> : : Just a point of clarification, please: It sounds as though you're : suggesting that these files are imported and become KeyWord rather than : .BRF files. (I share the files with someone still using a BLT so they : need to be .BRF.) Perhaps you could confirm whether this is what you're : meaning. : : Thanks. : : : -- : Carol : [EMAIL PROTECTED] : : : : -----Original Message----- : From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] : [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terri : Pannett : Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 5:03 PM : To: Braillenote List : Subject: Re: [Braillenote] Page Breaks : : : Hi, Carol and others, : : I believe the import option is the best because your defaults will never : : change without your permission, (grin). I believe the reason why the : defaults change when you remove and insert a compact flash card is : because : the data is stored on the card and not in the BN. Besides, every time : you : open a .brf or .txt file, you are asked to "review the options." But if : you : import documents into KeyWord, you won't receive this prompt and your : documents will remain the same because all the settings are stored in : the : BN. : : Here is how to set up your ASCII tranlsation options so all of your .txt : and : .brf files will open in line format: : : Go to the file manager. Press t for translation options and a for ASCII : : translation options. The first item on the list is "Use line or : paragraph?" : Press l for line. Exit the menu and confirm your changes. (You can : cycle : through the list and change other things, too.) : : I hope this helps. : : Terri, Amateur Radio call sign KF6CA. Army MARS call sign AAT9PX, : California : ----- Original Message ----- : From: "Carol Pearson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : To: "'Braillenote List'" <[email protected]> : Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 7:12 AM : Subject: RE: [Braillenote] Page Breaks : : :: Wow, Terry. I am so glad you have this experience and thanks for :: sharing it. It does sound a tad confusing. I was wondering why the :: defaults when opening files from a CF seemed to change from time to :: time. Do any of the BN resets affect these settings on the Flash : drive, :: by the way? How should I set up those ASCII translation :: options in the file translation menu to achieve preservation of those :: lines? :: :: I find myself lesss and less importing documents and more often : wanting :: to change the document format when in the word processor. Are you :: suggesting that it would be best to go back to the "import" way of : doing :: things or do those settings have any direct bearing on documents that :: are converted within the WP? :: :: I think maybe both Penny and myself would like the possibility of :: turning the information about the "line break" (caused when there's an :: overflow of what fits on the Braille display) to be totally invisible : so :: that dot 4-chord and/or the next thumb key really could mean the next :: line following a carriage return and the 5,6-chord could stay as next :: paragraph of course. <SMILE> :: :: I wonder if Penny and myself are the only ones experiencing this : problem :: because of our specific layout requirements. Others may like to think :: on this also and "chip in" with anything relevant. There's probably : no :: need or margin for what I suggested we may like in the previous :: paragraph, but I would like others to help me to work through that one :: if possible. :: :: Thanks, again, Terry for all your input. Keep it coming! <SMILE> :: :: (Finally, please, "Mr Moderators", if you want this subject thread : more :: suitably described, please either alter it or let me know because I'm :: not quite sure on your policy for such changes in subject as I know it :: can get horribly confusing when searching via threads. I'll leave it :: for the moment) :: :: :: -- :: Carol :: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :: :: :: :: -----Original Message----- :: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :: [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terri :: Pannett :: Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 6:07 PM :: To: Braillenote List :: Subject: Re: [Braillenote] Page Breaks :: :: :: Hi, Carol and others, :: :: Keysoft thinks in terms of pages. The maximum number of lines you can :: have :: on a page is 250 and the maximum characters you can have on a line is :: 250. :: A braille line on a standard piece of paper would be 40 or 42 for 11 : by :: 11.5 :: paper and 30-34 for 8.5 by 11 paper. I don't know what they are for : UK :: paper, but I believe the standard paper size in the UK is different : from :: the :: US. :: :: So, the BN will still show new line breaks and new page breaks because :: the :: original document already has them. If you should use the maximum :: margin :: settings, the BN will still show a soft page break and a soft return :: when :: words wrap to a new line. :: :: When you open a .brf file using the BN, you are asked if you want to :: review :: the settings. If you say yes, you will see that the questions are: : "Is :: this :: a braille or text document? Currently braille" "Use line or paragraph :: format when opening the document? Currently paragraph." "Use line or :: paragraph format when saving the document? Currently paragraph." If :: you :: choose to leave the defaults unchanged, then the document will be : opened :: as :: a braille file in paragraph format and saved in paragraph format when :: you :: exit it. :: :: Paragraph format is good if you want all single hard returns to be :: translated as single spaces and all double hard returns translated as :: paragraph markers. If you use speech to read a document in this : format, :: it :: will sound smooth and easy to listen to. :: :: But if you choose to open and save the document in line format, then : all :: :: hard returns will appear. This is good if you are reading a vocal : score :: :: where there the words are on one line and the music on the line under :: it. :: It is also good if you want to read line by line and have everything :: correspond to the original. If you use speech, the braille music : won't :: read :: correctly and a document written using no music braille but opened in :: line :: format will sound choppy. :: :: Although you don't plan to emboss your hymn book, if you coordinate : your :: :: lines and pages to match those of the original document and open it in :: paragraph format, then it should read as seamlessly as possible. :: :: If you always want to open and save .brf or ASCII text files in line :: mode :: instead of paragraph mode, it is best to set up the ASCII translation :: options in the file translation menu and use the import feature to :: import :: the documents into KeyWord before opening them. This is because if : you :: store all your files on a compact flash card and remove the card to : use :: it :: with your PC or to save the battery and later insert the card into : your :: BN, :: the ASCII files will open in paragraph format instead of line format. :: :: I know this sounds confusing. If you have any questions, please let : me :: know. :: :: Terri, Amateur Radio call sign KF6CA. Army MARS call sign AAT9PX, :: California :: ----- Original Message ----- :: From: "Carol Pearson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> :: To: "'Braillenote List'" <[email protected]> :: Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 2:22 AM :: Subject: RE: [Braillenote] Page Breaks :: :: ::: Terry, ::: ::: Trouble is, I'd personally like no page settings because, like Penny, :: I ::: don't need to emboss this; and, if I do, it would be good to be able :: to ::: put them there later. (I can't remember what the maximum character ::: width is, but I seem to remember that it still wasn't really going to ::: solve my problem. ::: ::: If we open in paragraph mode, what do we save in? (I find that all a ::: little confusing and examples would help me there because with some : of ::: my files, where there are lots of short note lines, it seems better : to ::: open in "Line". Any explanation would be appreciated here. ::: ::: I agree, I personally prefer the indented cell for the start of line. ::: ::: Well, we'll find a pretty near match very soon and it's still very ::: workable anyway. ::: ::: Thanks for all your help. ::: ::: ::: -- ::: Carol ::: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ::: ::: ::: ::: -----Original Message----- ::: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ::: [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terri ::: Pannett ::: Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2006 10:08 PM ::: To: Braillenote List ::: Subject: Re: [Braillenote] Page Breaks ::: ::: ::: Dear Penny, Carol and others, ::: ::: There are several suggestions you can try. ::: ::: First of all, make sure that your page length and width correspond to ::: the ::: pages you created in the original document. Your BN is probably set :: up ::: to ::: create a 25-line page length and a 40-cell page width but your hymn :: book ::: ::: might be using a 25 line length and a 30 cell width. To do this, :: create ::: a ::: blank braille document. Go to the "Page settings" list. Change the ::: page ::: length and width to the settings you want. To have these settings be ::: your ::: defaults, use the save command. (I don't know what it is on the BT, :: but ::: on ::: the QT, it's control s. Then, after you have saved the settings, : exit ::: the ::: menu. If you plan to emboss the hymn book, be sure to set up your ::: embosser ::: to match your document's settings. ::: ::: 2. When you open your hymn book files, be sure you open them in ::: paragraph ::: mode. Then, each single hard return will appear as a space and each ::: double ::: hard return will start a new paragraph. ::: ::: 3. The computer dollar sign l is the symbol for "soft returns" which ::: the BN ::: automatically adds when words wrap to a new line. You cannot get rid :: of ::: ::: them. These soft returns occur when your page width doesn't match : the ::: original. ::: ::: 4. If you don't want to see any soft or hard returns when you are ::: reading ::: the document, go to the braille display options menu. Choose to have ::: new ::: lines shown as an indented cell. There are other choices you can try ::: and ::: see which one fits you best. I happen to like the one indented cell. ::: ::: I hope this helps. ::: ::: Terri, Amateur Radio call sign KF6CA. Army MARS call sign AAT9PX, ::: California ::: ----- Original Message ----- ::: From: "Carol Pearson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ::: To: "'Braillenote List'" <[email protected]> ::: Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2006 1:44 AM ::: Subject: RE: [Braillenote] Page Breaks ::: ::: :::: Penny and all, :::: :::: I believe this is relevant to the way we use our BN's and, since I ::: want :::: to achieve exactly the same thing as yourself but, as yet, have not ::: been :::: able "quite" to do this, I would also welcome feedback. :::: :::: Thanks for raising this one. :::: :::: :::: -- :::: Carol :::: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :::: :::: :::: :::: -----Original Message----- :::: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :::: [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Penny :::: Golden :::: Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 5:55 AM :::: To: Braillenote List :::: Subject: Re: [Braillenote] Page Breaks :::: :::: :::: My own trouble with page breaks is a bit different. :::: :::: I am used to the Millennium 20--sorry, it's like saying Ford in a :::: Shevy showroom. Anyway, that's the way it is. :::: I put a control M after every hymn verse, and two between songs. In :::: the BN I get all kinds of linebreaks where I want them, where I : don't :::: want them. :::: I even get space-ed-sign-l-space; is this a different sort of :::: break? Now I know how to get rid of the return characters. In the :::: Find and replace it is a dots 25 with space--or what we would have :::: called an EN-sign chord. :::: I can replace them with a space, I guess. But that doesn't take : them :::: out of the text. :::: I want to have the BN pick up at every verse number when I hit the :::: dot-4 with space. I want it to pick up the next hymn in the series :::: with a dots 5-6 space. :::: How can I jimmy my old hymnbooks from the Millennium days so that :::: they do in the mpower bt what they used to do in the millennium. 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