At 14:06 2003-01-29 -0800, Gautam wrote:
No. I think that arguing that France and Germany are selfless is, almost by definition, ridiculous - when have they _ever_ acted in such a way? If you say that about the US, it's at least possible. It has happened.
It has happened post WWII. Before that, France was a colonial empire bent on dominating what parts of the world it could. The USA was trying to do the same, but all the good spots were already taken. The same holds for Germany except for the time that they spent recovering from WWI.
After WWII, the US did indeed show a lot of compassion. This is very honorable, but we could also say that after WWI, it was evident that pettiness wouldn't lead anywhere interesting. Furthermore, there was a popularity contest going on between the US and the USSR. Since then, pure generosity from the States has been scarce.
It's not a constant, or even predominant, in American policy, but it happens every once in a while. The argument - made usually by the left, that France and Germany oppose us, therefore we are wrong, is absurd. The argument that we need "Europe" to support us when most of Europe _is_ supporting us (England, Denmark, Italy, Spain, and _all_ of Eastern Europe just for a start) is equally kind of ridiculous. In this particular case, we know exactly what "The Axis of Weasel" is motivated by. This is a largely internal power play by the French and German governments to secure their dominance of the EU and challenge America's global position before the countries of Eastern Europe - all of which are pro-American, since they remember who stood up for them in the Cold War and who was happy to sell them up the river - enter the Union and weaken Franco-German power. Or do you think it's a coincidence that they proposed this dual Presidency nonsense for the EU almost simultaneously? It's also worth pointing out that France in particular will get significant commercial benefits if Hussein remains in power, while Schroeder is at _25%_ in the polls and has, historically, attacked the United States any time he needed a quick boost. But all of these things are ignored. It is, in fact, possible to construct a coherent argument opposing the war in Iraq. Stanley Hoffmann has done so in The American Prospect, for example. I worship the ground the man walks on, so I may disagree with him, but it's a good argument. It isn't, though, possible to use as one of those planks, "The French and Germans oppose it, so it must be immoral." That's absurd.
Of course it is, it's like saying that if Bush wants to go to war with Iraq, then they must be responsible for 9-11. Quoting the idiots from the opposing side doesn't get the discussion anywhere.
As for do I expect people to think of America better than America thinks of the world - well, I think rather highly of much of the world. My opinion of French and German elites is, umm, less kind. If they want to ruthlessly pursue their own power - which is what they are doing - then that's acceptable. That's what nations, on the whole, do, although the moral preening from a bunch of effective adolescents is tiresome. But Americans should, instead of deciding that these countries are avatars of all that's right and good, understand them for precisely what they are - two nations that would condemn, say, the people of Iraq to life in a totalitarian dictatorship, and Israel to genocide, if that meant improving their commercial position or their global power.
I don't agree. They would probably let Saddam stay where he is just because there's no good way to oust him. That's the problem with this situation. The US has decided on its own that enough was enough. It is making up the rules as it goes and what the world, including french and germans, are thinking is: what's it going to be next time? We're at a point in world politics where we can start interfering in other countries' business. That's all good and fun, but there should be rules and the rules shouldn't be written by just one country. If the US insists on playing by its own rules, it should expect that many countries won't want to play. Jean-Louis _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
