This is a continuation of my reply, rudely interrupted
by the library's closing Saturday <grumble, grumble>. 
(It closes at varying times - 5:30, 7 or 9 PM - but
all that is posted is "Closed Sunday and Wednesday.")

--- "John D. Giorgis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
<large snip>
> Moreover, we cannot afford to
> bring our troops home
> for a few months and send them back in the Fall.    

They certainly can't stay "indefinitely" as some on
the UN Security Council seem to be suggesting; just
out of curiosity, does anyone have a handle on what it
_would_ cost to bring them home and back again?  Would
it be more than the money offered to Turkey for use as
a full staging area?  (Of course, Turkey now has a new
PM who might be more inclined to do this.)

If the 'discovery' of warheads with multiple cluster
capability (for chemical, maybe bio matter too, IIRC
from the AM news) leads to their destruction this
week, those weapons won't be used against civilians or
our troops; every 'concession' wrung from Saddam
before outright war is advantagous.

> Thus, the window of opprotunity is now.   If this
> coalition that you prefer
> fails to materialize next week, as seems likely,
> then as Gautam stated, you
> are reduced to two options:
> 
> 1) Go it alone.
> 
> 2) Don't go in - or as we have noted, doing exactly
> what Saddam wants us to do.

Well, what Powell et al. are doing right now - intense
lobbying - is worth trying, as I think that from the
POV of much of the world a 'final deadline' ought to
be given by the UN, not the US or Britain.  One from
'us' is much more likely to be perceived as 'unfair,'
while one from the UN is fully justified under Res.
1441, and so is 'more fair.'

It might even convince Saddam that it's time to take
his money and go into exile, although I really think
that's a remote possibility.

It was mentioned in other posts that military action
is allowable/'legitimate' if the resolution is Chapter
VII; this was touched on very briefly this summer or
fall, when someone noted that, but pointed out that is
 'not a common' reason to go to war.  Does anyone know
off the top of their head how often this option has
been used before?  (I have over *400* posts to read
yet, so this might already be answered.)

> What do you choose?

As I have pointed out before, I haven't seen enough
info to agree that Iraq is a direct threat to the US
which would justify our 'going alone' (with a few
others); SH is clearly a threat to his own people, his
neighbors, and has failed to comply with UN
resolutions, which justifies UN-sanctioned military
action against him.  If the international community
wants US troops to stay as 'massive thumb-screws,'
they should contribute money to help pay for that.


<from another post, you wrote>
"I view the Catholic Church's pacifism as a valuable
brake upon public discourse to ensure that war truly
is the last resort.  This is a perfect role for the
Church, since ultimately, it does not have
responsibility for the decisions.

"I think that Catholic Church may even recognize that
its pacfisim will sometimes be wrong, but that
nevertheless it is valuable to be pacifist anyways."

Will you allow that there are other anti-war folks out
there who are as sincere in their beliefs as the Pope?
(I'm not a pacifist, but I agree that opposing views
are useful to promote clarity and dialogue.)

Debbi
who wonders if anyone else thinks that there must be a
joke in the deadline of St. Paddy's Day  


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