Thanks a lot for the detailed response. I've gotten most things to work as I've been working with it for about a year (when I'm able) so I have the luxury to spend a lot of time trying things out that professional developers with timeframes might not have. My only constraint is the wife and 3 kids ;)
You hit on a lot of topics in your response that have had my scratching my head saying "boy I sure do have to code a lot" to get things to work how I want them to. I've often considered just dropping a framework all together and started looking around. I too integrated doctrine 1.2 with my ZF for ORM, but it does add yet another layer on top of zend that I really don't like. I like to keep things as simple as possible. I tell you what...I'll give cake a try and see where I land...be patient with me if I ask stupid questions, but note that I did figure out ZF so... hopefully I won't have to many of those. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of #2Will Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 12:15 AM To: CakePHP Subject: Re: Cake PHP vs Zend In my mind its no contest. Use Cake. I have used zend framework quite a bit, and when i moved to cake it was such a massive relief. It's just so much easier to do anything in cake than ZF. ZF just seemed over complicated, awkward and confusing. The documentation is horrid. Ok so there is a page in the docs for most things, but they are always isolated. Code snippets that leave you scratching your head as to where you are supposed to put the code. The community here is much more helpful too. Cake seems to have a lovely blend of having a sensible opionion on everything (convention over configuration) and being able to customise everything when you need to. You arn't held hostage by the framework when the designer or client changes a requirement slightly that doesn't fit cake well. That stuff seems to happen every day with zend. Zend didn't even really have the basic application directories set up untill 1.9, resulting in every tutorial on the web having a different folder structure. Yes loosely coupled sounds cool in a feature list but in reality it just adds to ZF's horridiy(tm). Also, with Zend - it felt like we where having to fill in the gaps ourselves. an obvious example is the ORM - ZF's is useless. Relationships didn't seem to work / needed a massive amount of setup. We ended up integrating doctrine & although doctrine is gorgeous that's a lot of work just to get off the ground and inevitably didn't integrate as well as a native orm might. Another area of ultimate head-ache is forms. Making forms exactly how you want them is very difficult with zend. You have to get your head around "decorators" just to alter the mark-up away from dl/dt lists and it isn't easy. So that's databases and web forms failures in zend. don't know about everyone else but that's quite a big percentage of my work output right there. Iv'e just re-read your question and realised you arn't a full time developer. No wonder you are finding Zend hard. Kudos if you got much working. And the fact you are looking at other frameworks is a classic ZF developer trait. I used to do it all the time. that feeling that this can't be the best way to make the internet is not paranoia, it is your sub-concious stating the obvious. ....and breathe. will. On Jun 8, 10:03 am, "Meroe Kush" <[email protected]> wrote: > Folks, > > I'm facing a dilemma. I'm not a programmer by profession and do this work > as a hobby of mine. I ask this question in all fairness and not a slide > against any framework, but I am at a loss if I should stick with Zend or > switch over to Cake. > > The CRUD and full stack seems enticing. > > I'm working on what will be quite a large application with many modules, > authentication, permissions, task tracking, risks, issues, administration > (users, categories, organizations etc). > > If I ask the following question how would you respond? > > Why Cake over Zend or vice versa. I know this is a loaded question and one > that has probably been asked, but....here is another shot at it. Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://cakeqs.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions. You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "CakePHP" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=en No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.829 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2927 - Release Date: 06/09/10 02:35:00 Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://cakeqs.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions. You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "CakePHP" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=en
