On Thursday, February 04, 2016 01:55:19 PM Friedrich W. H. Kossebau wrote: > Hi Pierre, > > Am Dienstag, 2. Februar 2016, 22:21:59 schrieb Pierre: > > On Tuesday, February 02, 2016 02:08:53 PM Jaroslaw Staniek wrote: > > > On 1 February 2016 at 23:20, Pierre <pina...@pinaraf.info> wrote: > > > > Hi > > > > > > > > Right now, when we create a new empty document (at least for words), > > > > like > > > > any > > > > other office suite, it is created from a template. But we currently lack > > > > the > > > > reset of some metadata from our templates, leading to funny situations… > > > > For > > > > > > instance, any document created by calligra using the A4 template is more > > > > than > > > > 7 years old :) > > > > > > > > We have several possible fix : > > > > - strip metadata from templates : we would still copy the metadata for > > > > user > > > > > > templates, including creation date, bad imho > > > > - strip all metadata when creating a file from template : bad too, users > > > > could > > > > have specific metadata they don't want to lose > > > > - override specific metadata like the creation date with sane values > > > > > > > > Each one is very simple to implement, I just don't know which one is the > > > > best. > > > > I would go for the third option, but I don't have a list of metadata to > > > > erase. > > > > (we already override the generator BTW, but elsewhere in the saving > > > > code) > > > > > > > > Any thoughts on this ? > > > > > > Very interesting finding > > > , Pierre. > > > If you ask me, the 3rd option looks best. Documenting the new behaviour, > > > whatever it is, in the API docs, would be useful. > > > > I just went through the ODF 1.2 spec part regarding metadata, I think we > > should reset all the meta data defined in the spec except > > "meta:user-defined"… And remember to fill in the meta:template with the > > XLink to the source template. > > If nobody disagrees nor sees anything hazardous in it, I'll implement that.
Hi > Happy to see you pick this up, I have found this annoying/funny as well :) > > And I agree with & support your implementation plan basically, just a few > modifications I would like to propose, read on. > > IMHO the ODF spec has a flaw here WRT metadata and templates. Not only for metadata, there is almost no template specification, but that is understandable if we consider ODF to be a document representation specification and not an office suite specification. > There should be separate metadata for the actual template, and separate > metadata for the to-be-generated document. The first can be used as usual, > to know more about the template itself when managing templates, and the > second can be used to preset metadata of the actual generated document, as > it fits (e.g. keywords, language, or whatever user-defined keys are standard > with the organisation using the documents). (someone should bring this up in > the OASIS TC, what, me?) > > But we have to deal now with what there is in the current spec. So I would > agree that resetting/dumping most metadata on document creation makes sense. > > For the pre-defined metadata (as in ODF 1.2, §4.3.2) I think the following > metadata could be kept though, as they are about the document/content type > and less about the template, or only really make sense with the actual > document. > So if they are present and set, they could be considered to target the > created document, right? > * <meta:auto-reload> > * <meta:hyperlink-behaviour> > * <dc:language> > > For <meta:keyword> and <meta:user-defined> it is hard to tell, given their > less specific semantics. They could contain data only useful for template > management or could be preset metadata for the generated document. > Having to choose between the chance to leak template handling data into > generated documents and the inability to preset metadata for documents, the > second seems a greater issue for me (given I have no template tags like > "form letter to shutdown stupid customers" ;) ). > > So I agree, let's keep <meta:user-defined>, but then also <meta:keyword>. > > And then there is RDF metadata (§4.2.2), which for the non-content-specific > statements has the same problem as <meta:keyword> and <meta:user-defined>. > So better kept as is. > > Custom metadata (§4.3.1) would also be treated like <meta:keyword> and > <meta:user-defined> for the same reasons, keeping as is. > > So in summary, IMHO we should reset/drop these predefined metadata types: > <dc:title> - reset to empty > <dc:description> - reset to empty > <dc:subject> - reset to empty > <meta:initial-creator> - reset to current author profile > <dc:creator> - reset to current author profile > <meta:creation-date> - reset to "now" > <dc:date> - reset to "now" > <meta:editing-cycles> - reset to 1 > <meta:editing-duration> - reset to 0 > <meta:template> - reset to template iri > > <meta:printed-by> - dump > <meta:print-date> - dump > > <meta:generator> - generated on the fly when saving only > <meta:document-statistics> - generated on the fly when saving only > > Does this small adaption to your plan make sense to you as well? :) Well, we almost agree, just one thing : editing-cycles should be imho 0 since it's incremented while saving. If you creater the file, you expect that counter to go to one when you save it, so default should be 0 on creation before saving. I'll do that in the next days, thanks for the feedback !
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