--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Doug Swartz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> Monday, November 08, 2004, 3:05:33 PM, Kent Beck wrote:
>
>
> > Thank you for the clear statement of your position. I agree that no
> > individual metrics accurately reflect individual contribution to team
> > performance.
>
> > The dilemma is that our sponsors want and deserve accountability.
> > Metrics are a form of accountability. But the metrics are inadequate.
>
> > One part of responding to the request for individual metrics is to
> > respect the person making the request. They have a legitimate need and
> > they have paid me the compliment of asking my help in getting that
need
> > met. A simple way to respond is to do what they ask us. If they want
> > function points or lines of code, I'll find a way to give them
function
> > points or lines of code.
>
> > That may bring up unmet needs on my part (that's what I hear in the
> > violent reactions to Alfonso). I can try to hold those needs in,
dump my
> > fears on this mailing list (or the cat, or wherever). Alternatively, I
> > can expose my needs to the person making the request: the way I work,
> > I'm afraid that I will look bad compared to my colleagues. On my best
> > days I manage to add functionality to the project while removing lines
> > of code. I need some reassurance that I won't be punished for
this. Then
> > I listen to the answer.
>
> > The solution to the metrics question isn't a belligerent "we don't
need
> > no stinking metrics". The solution lies in using the request as a
way of
> > exploring the unspoken needs revealed by our emotional reaction to the
> > request, and using our response to the request as a way of
deepening our
> > work relationships.
>
> Kent, you're absolutely right.
>
> If I remember correctly... Two of the first three original
> responders in this thread asked what the customer's goal was
> in desiring metrics, and what kind of metrics were desired. I
> don't believe we've ever heard a response to those questions.
>
> The rest of the discussion here has primarily been based on
> fear. It's important to voice our fears, but they are best
> addressed with facts. We don't have any of the facts around
> the original request. Somehow we seem to have forgotten that
> the one sentence version of the the customer's request is
> simply an invitation to a conversation.
>
> I'm truly interested in discussions of what metrics the
> customer might be interested in, and how she intends to use
> them. I await more information.
I went back through the thread to see who did what
to whom, when.
The original question was asked by Jonathan Rasmussan.
The last post I have
from him was in response to Kent's post on the
training matrix. Quoted in full:
[begin quote]
This is brilliant - thank you.
Its the first idea I have seen the approaches what I have being very
unsuccessfully to articulate and measure.
Cheers - Jonathan
[end quote]
Most of the fireworks came from someone
else: Alfonso Guerra.
The first paragraph follows:
[quote]
It seems that the respondents are already afraid of the results of
this measurement. This fearful, negative reaction is symptomatic of an
adversarial relationship with management. Although managers might not
be part of the development team, they are still part of the team in
terms of the organization and are working towards the same goal (or so
one would hope).
[end quote]
In looking at other posts, the original poster
rather firmly rejected some of Alphonso's advice.
It's an interesting thread, and I will admit
that I didn't catch that the two were different
when it came up in a piece of off-list
correspondence.
John Roth
>
> --
>
> Doug Swartz
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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