Re: catalina27-talk: Larger boat

[Rudolph S. Behar]

My 2  cents. Probably most people know this, but most boats with right handed props will turn left if one starts from being stopped  and then one shoves the power up, a fact that my cruising manual explains by noting the marked diference in water density from the top of the prop to the bottom (hmn. . . ). In any case, when backing out of my slip, which is a 90 degrees from the channel I wish to enter, I would, when just learning,  back to be parallel to the course I wished to take, then go hard into forward, to stop the rearward track of  the boat.  Took me a  couple of times to learn that this was going to put me, in increasing panic, into a left hand circle,right back to the shore(!)  ) Had to reverse a couple of times, which did not solve the problem, and found myself  a couple of times having to make a full 360 to get on course, much too close  to shoal water for comfort. The more throttle I gave the engine, the  more the boat would go left.  Steering right with the tiller had no effect. As soon as the boat got some way on, it went straight .  Simple solution:  back 90 degrees to the left, then another 45 degrees.  Now when I go into forward the boat swings through the extra 45 degrees to the course I want. Startiing had forward from a dead stop alongside a pier put my stern into the dock. Trick here is not to start hard forward  Go gentle until you have some way on. My boat has an ordinary fin keel and a 9.9hp outboard.  So there's nothing special here, but this dingy sailor had somethings to learn.  The "problem" is universal.. Right handed prop boats will swing to the left when going forward from reverse or, less so,  when going forward from a full stop. Do fin keels exaggerate the problem?  I dunno, but the one fin keel I've sailed for any length of time had no problem from its berth(and  tracked beautifully and a full 3 degrees closer to the wind than I'm used to going. It was on an O'Day 32.) Rudy B. Phoenix, #2237 Pasadena, MD Mike Crawford wrote: My '89 TR Wing Keel will turn HARD left if one shoves the power up.  Trims up very well under sail   Mike Crawford Elena Colleen # 6644 Pickwick Lake, TN ----- Original Message ----- From: Don Brooks To: catalina27-talk@memberclicks.com Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 6:49 PM Subject: RE: catalina27-talk: Larger boat Phil,   Seems like we hashed this out a while ago and did not really come to an answer then.  But it cold outside and not much better to do.  I think Dr Judy's boat likes to turn left under power but sails the same on either tack.  I have only sailed two wing keels boats (c30 with fixed 3 blade and the c28 with a 2 blade fixed) and both really turn left hard if you let go of the wheel.  I think all right handed prop boats turn a little or a lot to the left under power.  My 27 with a 2 blade fixed prop will make a very slow and gradual left turn with very light pressure on the wheel to go straight.  The 28 requires a good grip on the wheel unless the friction know is turned tight.  The owner of the 28 did tell me that the 28MkII has an upgraded rudder and a retrofit is available from Catalina for the MkI for about 10 boat units.   It is still a small thing and certainly would not turn me off from buying! that boat if the price was right.    We took a 211km cruise last summer with the 28 and another boat.  On all points of sail, the 28 could not pass our 27.  Maybe I was just trying harder.   Don, #6293, Niceville, FL   Phil Agur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Don,   “… common to wing keels, a hard pull to the left under power.”   ! ?That’s most likely one of those urban legend things, with some basis in fact but not the obvious one. I use to race a fin keeled partnership boat where the other partner’s family boat was a wing keel. He was convinced that all wing keels pulled to the right under sail so doing a circle to starboard in a drifter was unavoidable. I ended the race partnership after he threw a race that turned into a drifter by unconsciously turning the boat to starboard. I let him get 180? out of sync with the rest of the fleet before I reminded him this wasn’t a wing keel.   Some years later I noted he had a bent stub on his wing keel, I’d say almost 10?. And so he was right, his wing keel behaved exactly that way.   Wing Tip (our wing keel), admittedly a newer design than the C28, has no hard pull to the right under power. She’s not as well mannered under power as under sail but very few boats love “sailing in the groove” as much as a C270 anyway. I think under power if you let the wheel go without any drag over a minute or two she will tend to veer to the right as the wheel moves. Under sail from a beat to a broad reach all she asks is you lock the wheel and she will change heading to make the ribbons fly on her own. I thought the skipper who first told me this about the C270 was pulling my leg so I let a year go by before I tried it.   So there’s a bit of a defect in the operation of at least that particular C28. I’d start by asking which prop they have and verify independently is the stock size and type. Skippers sometimes want what they want and don’t realize they can upset the geometry between the strut, prop, hull, and rudder and impact prop walk with minor sounding changes.   Wing keels do behave differently from fin keels but pulling one way or the other isn’t one of those things. ????   Phil Agur? ????????????????? s/v Wing Tip Commodore,             Call Sign WCW3485 IC27/270A                   MMSI 366901790 www.catalina27.org????? Vessel Doc# 1039809 -----Original Message----- From: catalina27-talk@memberclicks.com [mailto:catalina27-talk@memberclicks.com] On Behalf Of Don Brooks Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 8:18 AM To: ! catalina27-talk@memberclicks.com Subject: catalina27-talk: Larger boat   I am not really in the market for a larger boat, but my dock mates are looking for their "retirement boat" and have offered me a good deal on their 1991 c28 Mk-I wing if they find one.  I like the walk thru stern, smooth 3 cylinder engine, large aft head, small nav station, and larger galley.  I have sailed the boat and it handles nicely.  It does have one thing that seems to be common to wing keels, a har! d pull to the left under power.  The c28 website doesn't seem to work anymore and since there are not a lot of c28's out there, does anyone have any experience with the c28?   Don, #6293, Niceville, FL  Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos,! events, holidays, whatever. Yahoo! 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