You may want to approach the estimation not as set cost. Sit with him and work on the scope of the project. Get his approval.
Create a wireframe of the application from the specification. Get his approval. Create a prototype of the applications. Get his approval. .... You get the point. You invoice him for each portion of the application. I typically can only give an estimation of cost when the understanding of the scope has been outlined. This invovles the client committing to the planning phase. if you do not charge for planning, he will not take your time seriously and will abuse it. Also, once you have estimated the completion, I would suggest that the client put down earnest money of 20% that will show commitment. You don't want to be in a project where the client is not going to pay you or shows no commitment and leaves you hanging out to dry. The Flip process is great way to plan for this and then add a layer of legal documents to get signatures. Protect yourself. Teddy On 1/12/07, Mike Kear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Mark's dead right. Make sure you know what the scope of your job is, and > that you can do it for that money. IF you're pretty impoverished, $3500 > can sound like a lot, but you really do need to work out how much per hour > that represents for you. You might be able to dash this job out with > just > bolting together some components that are already written, do the job > inside > 10 hours and you're making $350/hour. Well done. > > On the other hand you probably arent going to be able to do all that stuff > in 10 hours. > > At the risk of belabouring the point, perhaps I can tell you about how I > learned this lesson the hard way, even though it already made sense before > that. I guess i just lost touch with my senses or something. > > "I just need a login done, that's all, and a couple of other functions," > the > client said. "A couple of days work, maximum," he assured me. Like a > bloody fool I didnt get him to spell out what "... a couple of other > functions" meant. > > I gave him a price, he accepted it and since I had a couple of days before > i > was going to start another project, I figured it would be a good little > earner in what would otherwise have been dead time. > > When i started on the actual work, I downloaded what had been done up to > that point, only to discover the previous developer on this job had left a > HEAP of things non working. Lots of pretty forms, that looked terrific, > had all the validation etc but didnt have any action pages. I figured > this whole project was a dead duck unless someone (me i guessed) wrote > all > the processing. Then i learned that a lot of the validation was pretty > dodgy too and didnt do what it was supposed to do. So I had to fix that > up > too. > > Instead of being a quick little two-day job in between assignments, the > job > turned into a 3 month after-hours-and-weekends project. Things just kept > on popping up that needed doing, and like a fool I said I'd do them, and > when the client said he couldnt afford any more development money, i was > stupid enough to say well he can pay me one day when he gets some income > coming from the site. > > I did the arithmetic after i finally finished the job and worked out that > i > had earned the princely sum of 50cents an hour unless he came good on the > promise to pay me more when he had some. He gave me a lovely hamper at > Christmas time, which was wonderful, but I'm still waiting for more money. > (And i know who the previous developer was who left so many thing undone > and > he's going to get a bloody nose when i meet him next!!0 > > I think lots of people either see situations like this in time and avoid > them, or learn about them the hard way, but the important thing is that > everyone understands they're going to come up against it sooner or later > and > its time to be hard nosed about it. > > You need to fully understand what you're getting into and how much it's > going to cost you in money terms and in hours. And make sure before you > do > anything that you and the client are in agreement about what you're > actually > going to build. If you dont agree BEFORE you start on what you're going > to > do, you run the risk of seeing your time soaked up by the project. > $3500 might be a terrific price for you if you take a couple of days to do > the job. But what if it takes you 3 months? Is $3500 still a good price > for working for 3 months? > > > Thats my advice - before you do anything, KNOW for sure and have it > written > down and agreed . what you are going to do. More specific is better than > less specific. And have a pretty good idea in your own mind how you are > going to do it. (are you going to provide any of the elements by > buying it ready-made or are you going to cut it all yourself?) > > > Cheers > Mike Kear > Windsor, NSW, Australia > Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer > AFP Webworks > http://afpwebworks.com > ColdFusion, PHP, ASP, ASP.NET hosting from AUD$15/month > > > > On 1/13/07, Mark A Kruger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > If you are talking about all custom development I'd say that 3500 will > > cover > > writing the requirements document....after that you are going to be > > working > > for free :) Pull out your calculator and figure hours per application > > piece. Add 5% for documentation and 10 to 15% for debug and revision - > and > > then add 10 hours to that for good measure. Multiply that number by > > whatever > > you want to make hourly... Even at a low hourly rate it would have to be > > higher than 3500.00. Did you mean 35,000? > > > > As for the "why to use CF" question. Sharpen your pencil - you are about > > to > > get a bunch of passionate posts :) > > > > -Mark > > > > ----- > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Create robust enterprise, web RIAs. Upgrade & integrate Adobe Coldfusion MX7 with Flex 2 http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;56760587;14748456;a?http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/flex2/?sdid=LVNU Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/CF-Talk/message.cfm/messageid:266385 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/CF-Talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
