Perhaps it's only my take on things, but I don't feel this way Chris. I'm not feeling insecure, or left in the code. My efforts here are only intended to discuss parts that are missing from DWMX that CF Studio users feel are critical. Or the paradigm shift in how to think about our applications.
As for MM's response, I'm seeing a healthy discussion - even though it seems that some folks at MM don't quite understand what the fuss is about. That's fine - that's the purpose behind a discussion - to share a viewpoint and promote understanding. And I think with Ben Forta's post on behalf of Dave Deming shows that our thoughts ARE being considered. But we all have to be realistic - MM has a product they are pushing hard to get to market. They are at release candidate stage. And THEN we hit them with this discussion... what should they do? Drop the product? Delay delivery to address these issues? No, that would be a bad business move. So they are approaching it correctly I think, thus far... Deliver the best product to meet the current requirements. Then integrate the issues resulting from this discussion into the requirements, and develop the next version to address these issues. This is a good project model. We have to give them time to get there. However, we will have to see if these issues are in fact addressed. If not, then I for one will likely not bother upgrading down the road... But then again, I don't really have that choice either - my client's make that choice for me. If they don't specify a tool, then I'm free to choose my own, otherwise, I have to use what they want. In that case, it makes sense for me to be aware of the other tools, and how to get the job done there. That's my take. No real cares about the tools per se, but how the tools help me with my job. I see some limitations (as well as some great features) in the current DWMX. But as a coder, Studio is still my tool of choice. Shawn Grover -----Original Message----- From: Chris Stoner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 9:30 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: Macromedia Folks: What are you thinking? Christine, I won't try to talk for everyone here however, as a developer who spends more time in code then in the look and feel part of a web page, I an see why everyone is getting a little rude here. We as Cold Fusion developers have enjoyed a relationship with Allaire that made us feel as if we were extremely valued, because we were. We were the primary (or at least influencers to the primary) source of revenue for allaire. Now, Allaire is no more. Macromedia has come in and apparently shifted that view. No longer are the coders paramount but rather the desktop publishers/graphic artist types. Now you (Macromedia) drop our favorite tool, replace it with something that is more geared to the WSYIWYG-S editor types and we are left in the cold. On top of that, in this thread alone, your replies have been more like "get used to it" rather then "let us see what we can do to fix this situation". We are not used to that. Hell, if I were to imply that to my customers, I would be fired. Which brings me to my point. It appears at first glance that the old group of developers are no longer your customer, we are just leftovers. You are hitting people in their sense of security even if it is only perception and saying or doing nothing to make us feel different. We are discussing details on an IDE, which by itself is somewhat benign, but if you look at the overall attitude (and perceived direction) of Macromedia, you should be able to easily see why we are getting a bit worried and/or frustrated with the situation. C H R I S S T O N E R time warner cable tampa bay division [EMAIL PROTECTED] -----Original Message----- From: Christine Lawson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 10:15 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: Macromedia Folks: What are you thinking? Hi Everyone, I know Mike Chambers and Nathan Stanford already pointed this out, but Neil is not a Macromedia employee. He's a Team Macromedia member, but not an employee, and his views are his own - not Macromedia's. Anyhow, I've been using CF Studio for a long time, I'm also one of the CF'ers Vernon spoke to yesterday and we went through the differences between CF Studio and Dreamweaver MX. I know a number of people on this list from the Allaire days and I (and everyone else at Macromedia) value *all* of your feedback. I know Vernon already pointed out the wishform, and yup, I'm going to point it out again :) http://www.macromedia.com/support/email/wishform?6213=6 PLEASE post your feedback, it really can help develop future versions of our products... However, I'm also going to go through each and every one of these messages and make my own summary of your wants/needs/opinions so your feedback is organized and clear. If I find something that can be done in Dreamweaver, I'll be sure to post with the steps. In the meantime I have one request: please, please, please, can we be polite when we post? I know the majority of people have been but Michael Dinowitz has been nice enough to host this list for us - we're all in the same boat here let's please respect one another's opinions. I hope this helps, now I'm on to organizing your feedback... Christine Lawson Macromedia Technical Support -----Original Message----- From: Mark A. Kruger - CFG [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 9:01 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: Macromedia Folks: What are you thinking? *********** you wrote ***************** OK so now we're being told by MM what is and is NOT good practice, dont seem right to me lol we should be able to access files directly with RDS/FTp of course mistakes happen but you'll have people making mistakes with this style of doing it too. Did you get alot of people yelling at MM saying OHHH because i was able to access files directly with RDS i fubared my whole site and i'm going to sue MM?? No they said damnit i goofed and fixed it. ************************************** Somewhat ironic as well - considering the amount of time I have to take on a regular basis hand editing DW files so they conform to our coding standards - sometimes I can't believe all the crap DW puts in the files my content people save to the site. But (sigh), I guess I'm just a careless RDS users (LOL). ______________________________________________________________________ Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
