Amie...please don't be offended...I didn't mean it that way...it just is frustrating to hear "A vet said he had seen many dogs die because of raw feeding"...I am not so much questioning you as I am that vet!! I think without proof nothing like that should be said...and unfortunately we don't know the whole situation with your friend and what exactly was fed and how...All i was trying to say is if a Vet says that...then there should be proof and neocropsies and documentaion etc like was available with the kibble and canned food issues. It sounds so vague and such an unprofessional thing to just say...thats all I was saying...or trying to say. I so agree with what you have said about doing research but you made some comments about feeding raw that I could have been offended by...like risking the life of my babies by feeding raw? I know you most likely didn't mean it that way but it sounded...in conection with your other warnings... that you were alluding to that...and you need to know that this decision did not come lightly for me!!! It was YEARS of research...not a few days...not a few stories...not a few whackos on the internet. I WOULD never risk the lives of my dogs...never! I would NOT do anything to them or for them that i have not researched thouroughly. Everyone needs to find what works for them...i cooked for my guys for years! They were not unhealthy because of it!!! But i will tell you they are better off now. It is just a simple fact...for me! Everyone has opinions and I think it is wonderful to share them...but I think it is damaging to say "a vet said..."and then just leave that there...that is how bad rumours and mis-information gets spread on the internet!. So...please...I did not mean to offend...and I know you didn't either but lets put it in the past and move on. I learn this way...from the ideas of others and if nothing else our little "banter" here will get others to do their homework...i hope!Hugs In Him, Deanna
And the Corey Crew: Wife to my best friend: Mark-ie Pooh...married 29 years 6/27/10 Mom to 4 Children: Andrea 26, Jimmy 22, Baxter 19 and Molly 11 Grandma to 4: Lori, Evelyn Rose, Jack and Cameron Mom to Fur babies: Nugget (MiniPoodle)www.dogster.com/dogs/1085245, Shuai-Li (Shih Tzu)www.dogster.com/dogs/1129251, Bella-Rose (Pomeranian)http://www.dogster.com/dogs/1136706 Mouse (Chihuahua)www.dogster.com/dogs/1005934, Myrtle May (Chihuahua) and Caleb (Rott/chow mix)www.dogster.com/dogs/988612 Mom to feathered kids: Stella (Blue and Gold Macaw) and Stanley (Double Yellow Headed Amazon) and the curtain climber: Miles www.catster.com/cats/895000 ________________________________ From: Amie McCaig <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, August 20, 2010 7:32:36 PM Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet Deanna, I'm trying very hard not to be offended by your comment of proof; either you are calling me, and my dear friend, who has bred and shown chis for more then 20 years and her vet a lier. In my comments I did not personally attack you, or your opinion. I simply requested that research be done, before blindlly following. amie --- On Sat, 8/21/10, Deanna Corey <[email protected]> wrote: >From: Deanna Corey <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >To: [email protected] >Date: Saturday, August 21, 2010, 2:06 AM > > > >I would LOVE to see proof that she saw so many dogs die from feeding raw...I >do >not believe it for one second! I also do not believe they are tiny wolves. >They >are however, carnivores...that require meat! Small...big...bred to toy size or >bred to Great dane size makes no difference...they are carnivores. And if we >are >gonna start saying that dogs die because of raw food...then I want more proof >than..."She said"...I want documentation...like the documentation that was >presented when dogs were dying from the recalled kibble!! > Hugs In Him, >Deanna > >And the Corey Crew: > >Wife to my best friend: Mark-ie Pooh...married 29 years 6/27/10 >Mom to 4 Children: Andrea 26, Jimmy 22, Baxter 19 and Molly 11 >Grandma to 4: Lori, Evelyn Rose, Jack and Cameron > >Mom to Fur babies: >Nugget (MiniPoodle)www.dogster.com/dogs/1085245, >Shuai-Li (Shih Tzu)www.dogster.com/dogs/1129251, >Bella-Rose (Pomeranian)http://www.dogster.com/dogs/1136706 >Mouse (Chihuahua)www.dogster.com/dogs/1005934, >Myrtle May (Chihuahua) >and Caleb (Rott/chow mix)www.dogster.com/dogs/988612 > >Mom to feathered kids: Stella (Blue and Gold Macaw) and Stanley (Double Yellow >Headed Amazon) > >and the curtain climber: Miles www.catster.com/cats/895000 > > > > > ________________________________ From: Amie McCaig <[email protected]> >To: [email protected] >Sent: Fri, August 20, 2010 6:45:29 PM >Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet > > >I was going to post my opinion on this topic when the conversation started a >few >weeks ago... > >I don't want to cause an issues, however I feel like you should know both >sides. >I have a very dear friend and breeder of champion chihuahuas, who use to feed >a >raw diet, five years she did this.... >Until 2 of her champion dogs died from pancreatitis. she fed all human grade >meat, that she purchased at the grocery store. they both died receiving vet >care. when the vet finally got out of her what she was feeding, she said she >see >a lot of dogs die from feeding raw. not to mention how many times she has >opened >a dog up with impacted bones, even food that has been ground-up. >She still has a friend that feed raw, and her dogs have the nastiest teeth she >has ever seen...if clean teeth is your concern, there are a lot of good >products >to use for that. > > >there is a lot of information on raw diets. PLEASE.. do your own research.... > > >one last thought, please remember a chihuahua's are a TOY DOG, not wolves. >they >would never survive in the wild and so far removed from wolves, they are a man >made breed, so lets not pretend they are toy wolves... > > >and again, this is MY OPINION... please do your own research, before you put >our beloved pets life at risk. > > >amie >--- On Sat, 8/21/10, Darcy Jacobs <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>From: Darcy Jacobs <[email protected]> >>Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>To: [email protected] >>Date: Saturday, August 21, 2010, 1:13 AM >> >> >> >>well it takes a very long time to make change... i just know once a raw plan >>is >>established and the dog has been given enough time to properly adjust i know >>of >>no one who has gone back to kibble...and im on 3 very busy boards.... you let >>me >>know if anyone poses a question you want help to answer =)~... >>darcy >> >>--- On Fri, 8/20/10, Joyce mccarthy <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >>>From: Joyce mccarthy <[email protected]> >>>Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>To: [email protected] >>>Date: Friday, August 20, 2010, 6:30 PM >>> >>> >>> >>>Like I said I am going to try and figure out the cost to feed my gang...I >>>asked >>>about this amongst my own group and the breeders there and there is more CON >>>then there is Pro but from seeing how the dogs go up and down at times and >>>how >>>much waste they create...I am willing to try.. >>> >>> >>>On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 6:18 PM, Darcy Jacobs <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>>>you have gotten great advice... id just add..... use your liver and bone >>>>content >>>>to adjust the elimination consistancy of the dogs... too hard add more >>>>liver too >>>>soft add more bone... >>>>darcy >>>> >>>> >>>>--- On Fri, 8/20/10, dasha <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>>From: dasha <[email protected]> >>>>> >>>>>Subject: RE: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>>>To: [email protected] >>>>>Date: Friday, August 20, 2010, 3:13 PM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Well you know breast fed babies don't eat as much at a single feeding as >>>>>bottle >>>>>fed babies. And it is harder to gauge how much they have had. I have done >>>>>both >>>>>and putting a breast fed baby on a schedule never made any sense to me at >>>>>all. >>>>>Sometimes the more people learn, the more complicated things become. >>>>>Simple can >>>>>really be better. Plus what goes around usually comes around >>>>> >>>>>Sheila >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Deanna Corey >>>>>Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 2:31 PM >>>>>To: [email protected] >>>>>Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>I had so many friends that got on me for demand feeding Dasha...they >>>>>thought I >>>>>was nuts...but ya have to remember that was 25 years ago! People have >>>>>learned a >>>>>lot since then...or should I say "unlearned"...sometimes the old simple >>>>>ways are >>>>>the best...just like we are un-learning with our dogs as well! >>>>> Hugs In Him, >>>>>Deanna >>>>> >>>>>And the Corey Crew: >>>>> >>>>>Wife to my best friend: Mark-ie Pooh...married 29 years 6/27/10 >>>>>Mom to 4 Children: Andrea 26, Jimmy 22, Baxter 19 and Molly 11 >>>>>Grandma to 4: Lori, Evelyn Rose, Jack and Cameron >>>>> >>>>>Mom to Fur babies: >>>>>Nugget (MiniPoodle)www.dogster.com/dogs/1085245, >>>>>Shuai-Li (Shih Tzu)www.dogster.com/dogs/1129251, >>>>>Bella-Rose (Pomeranian)http://www.dogster.com/dogs/1136706 >>>>>Mouse (Chihuahua)www.dogster.com/dogs/1005934, >>>>>Myrtle May (Chihuahua) >>>>>and Caleb (Rott/chow mix)www.dogster.com/dogs/988612 >>>>> >>>>>Mom to feathered kids: Stella (Blue and Gold Macaw) and Stanley (Double >>>>>Yellow >>>>>Headed Amazon) >>>>> >>>>>and the curtain climber: Miles www.catster.com/cats/895000 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ From: dasha <[email protected]> >>>>>To: [email protected] >>>>>Sent: Fri, August 20, 2010 11:22:28 AM >>>>>Subject: RE: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>I could not imagine feeding a breast fed baby on a schedule. That seems >>>>>like >>>>>more hassle than it is worth cause breast fed babies eat differently than >>>>>the >>>>>bottle fed ones.. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Deanna Corey >>>>>Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 2:16 PM >>>>>To: [email protected] >>>>>Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Joyce...I needed to add something I forgot...with mine under 6 months I >>>>>feed >>>>>till they are full...I don't weigh everything out. I know many would >>>>>disagree >>>>>with this but puppies should not be regulated in my opinion...and I feed >>>>>anyone >>>>>under a year 3 times a day not two...especially tiny Chi's. BUT i am also >>>>>the >>>>>nut who breast fed my babies on demand when they wanted it...not scheduled >>>>>LOL! >>>>> Hugs In Him, >>>>>Deanna >>>>> >>>>>And the Corey Crew: >>>>> >>>>>Wife to my best friend: Mark-ie Pooh...married 29 years 6/27/10 >>>>>Mom to 4 Children: Andrea 26, Jimmy 22, Baxter 19 and Molly 11 >>>>>Grandma to 4: Lori, Evelyn Rose, Jack and Cameron >>>>> >>>>>Mom to Fur babies: >>>>>Nugget (MiniPoodle)www.dogster.com/dogs/1085245, >>>>>Shuai-Li (Shih Tzu)www.dogster.com/dogs/1129251, >>>>>Bella-Rose (Pomeranian)http://www.dogster.com/dogs/1136706 >>>>>Mouse (Chihuahua)www.dogster.com/dogs/1005934, >>>>>Myrtle May (Chihuahua) >>>>>and Caleb (Rott/chow mix)www.dogster.com/dogs/988612 >>>>> >>>>>Mom to feathered kids: Stella (Blue and Gold Macaw) and Stanley (Double >>>>>Yellow >>>>>Headed Amazon) >>>>> >>>>>and the curtain climber: Miles www.catster.com/cats/895000 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ From: Joyce mccarthy <[email protected]> >>>>>To: [email protected] >>>>>Sent: Fri, August 20, 2010 10:56:20 AM >>>>>Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Thanks Deanna I have fed them meats before but not raw...I know a no no >>>>>LOL..1.2 >>>>>oz seems like nothing per dog but maybe being raw is the difference..I >>>>>will have >>>>>to look at the grinder as well...and other then the egg shells is there >>>>>anything >>>>>else I add to it?? In my group so many are against the RAW diet but I >>>>>think >>>>>several have had issues with dry food and diets lately.. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 1:47 PM, Deanna Corey <[email protected]> >wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>Joyce, >>>>>>Lets say each Chi weighs an average of 5lbs. ...you say you have >>>>>>10...that is >>>>>>50lbs of dog you need to feed. Each dog needs 3% of their body weight in >>>>>>food >>>>>>each day...so for 10, 5lbs dogs that would be 24 ounces each day for 10 >>>>>>dogs OR >>>>>>roughly 1and 1/2 lbs of food total a day...I would round it up to 2lbs >>>>>>each day >>>>>>to be safe. I might use the left over for treats or to have some first >>>>>>thing in >>>>>>the morning. I would divide each meal into 2 servings of 1.2 oz each and >>>>>>feed >>>>>>one in the morning and one in the early evening. >>>>>> >>>>>>I would start Chi's on chicken breast as it is the easiest meat to >>>>>>digest. The >>>>>>dark meat has more fat so a little harder to digest. I would remove the >>>>>>skin of >>>>>>the breasts and I would throw them into the grinder and feed ground. No >>>>>>worries >>>>>>about bone splinters with the little guys and they will still get the >>>>>>nutrients >>>>>>from the bone. Then after I had them use to the breasts for awhile I >>>>>>would add >>>>>>in other meats...dark meat, lamb, lean beef, etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>If you do not have a grinder then what I would do is to still start with >>>>>>the >>>>>>breasts and chop the meat with a knife into appropriate size Chi chunks. >>>>>>Then I >>>>>>would take a few dry eggs shells from my breakfast and pulverize them >>>>>>either in >>>>>>a little electric coffee grinder, a mixing wand or a little pestal/mortar >>>>>>type >>>>>>thing and add 1 tsp of the egg shell per 1 lb of meat to my breast chunks >>>>>>to >>>>>>make up for the calcium loss from no bone until I could get a grinder. >>>>>> >>>>>>If you want a grinder...the best I have found is the maverick...$99 >>>>>>through >>>>>>www.pierceequipment.com >>>>>>then put 575 Watt MM5501 Meat Food Grinder- >>>>>>in the search bar at the sight. >>>>>> >>>>>>Here are all the ratios you will need in the future: >>>>>>1.Dogs need 3% of their DESIRED body weight each day...as a general rule >>>>>>2. To find 3%...take the weight of your dog (we will use 5 lbs for >>>>>>example here) >>>>>>and multiply that weight by 16 >>>>>>5lbs x 16=80 80= ounces your dog weighs >>>>>>now divide 80 by 3%= 2.4 oz. Each 5lb dog needs 2.4 oz of food each day. >>>>>>Use a >>>>>>calculator and punch in...in this order: >>>>>>80 >>>>>>/ >>>>>>3 >>>>>>% >>>>>>This formula will be different if your dog weighs more or less than 5 >>>>>>lbs...but >>>>>>whatever your dogs weight??? Just multiply by 16 to get your dogs weight >>>>>>in >>>>>>ounces...only the number 80 will change in the formula...then you will >>>>>>have the >>>>>>amount of OUNCES of food each dog needs to have. >>>>>> >>>>>>3. Dogs need a mix of 85% meat, 10% bone and 5% organ (liver, kidney) >>>>>>(don't >>>>>>feed organ meats daily) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hugs In Him, >>>>>>Deanna >>>>>> >>>>>>And the Corey Crew: >>>>>> >>>>>>Wife to my best friend: Mark-ie Pooh...married 29 years 6/27/10 >>>>>>Mom to 4 Children: Andrea 26, Jimmy 22, Baxter 19 and Molly 11 >>>>>>Grandma to 4: Lori, Evelyn Rose, Jack and Cameron >>>>>> >>>>>>Mom to Fur babies: >>>>>>Nugget (MiniPoodle)www.dogster.com/dogs/1085245, >>>>>>Shuai-Li (Shih Tzu)www.dogster.com/dogs/1129251, >>>>>>Bella-Rose (Pomeranian)http://www.dogster.com/dogs/1136706 >>>>>>Mouse (Chihuahua)www.dogster.com/dogs/1005934, >>>>>>Myrtle May (Chihuahua) >>>>>>and Caleb (Rott/chow mix)www.dogster.com/dogs/988612 >>>>>> >>>>>>Mom to feathered kids: Stella (Blue and Gold Macaw) and Stanley (Double >>>>>>Yellow >>>>>>Headed Amazon) >>>>>> >>>>>>and the curtain climber: Miles www.catster.com/cats/895000 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ________________________________ From: Joyce mccarthy <[email protected]> >>>>>>To: [email protected] >>>>>>Sent: Fri, August 20, 2010 9:40:54 AM >>>>>>Subject: [Chihuahuas] Raw diet >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>Darcy and those who feed?? Ok say for every 10 dogs one may have.. all >>>>>>chi's how >>>>>>much food would you make at a time and and do you have Recipes you go >>>>>>by?? >>>>>> >>>>>>-- >>>>>>Joyce >>>>>>www.mtnviewchis.webs.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>-- >>>>>Joyce >>>>>www.mtnviewchis.webs.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>>-- >>>Joyce >>>www.mtnviewchis.webs.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >
