Fellow Churchillians: In response to reference to 'manly man' in Finest Hour- August 10, 2010 Since the ‘manly man’ issue has been brought up again I would like my side of the issue printed—I mistakenly thought it would be the gracious option to let the Finest Hour have the last word…but it is again resurrected and will not go quietly into oblivion so here’s the complete saga. Carol Lea Mueller NOT Churchill Chat’s Finest Hour As a participant (cm) in the ‘manly man’ thread on line, I was dismayed to see it resurrected in the Summer 2009 edition of the Finest Hour, Journal of the Churchill Centre, on page 62. An amazing selection when one considers the wealth of worthier material available to highlight. Further, two important entries were edited out—a response to my posting by the originator of the thread which is not ‘lighthearted’ as his website (www.he-manwomanhaters-club.net) is described in the Finest Hour and my own omitted apologia. To clarify any doubts, I am not a ‘man-hater’ –in fact I am the author of The Quotable John Wayne the Grit and Wisdom of an American Icon—definitely a ‘manly man’. Further, in my own attempt to be ‘lighthearted’ it was misconstrued that I did not think Sir Winston was ‘manly’—nothing could be further from the truth. In the interest of being fair and balanced: --- On Sun, 4/26/09, James T. Slattery <[email protected]> wrote: From: James T. Slattery <[email protected]> Subject: [ChurchillChat] Re: Book Recommendation To: [email protected] Date: Sunday, April 26, 2009, 6:54 PM Dear Ms. Mueller, Thank you for exemplifying why my men's only group exists. Your response is similar to other women who are threatened with the idea that men might actually enjoy each others company and want to engage in activities without having to ask for permission or support from women and that men would want to work towards regaining their status in society. By the way, my group is one of only three men's only groups that I know of in San Antonio whereas there are over fifteen women only groups i.e.. Chambers of Commerce, Scrape Booking, Bible Study, Retreats, etc. and this was Fiesta week in San Antonio where the Battle of the Flowers Parade was held which is proudly trumpeted as being lead and organized by a women's only group with over 600 members. (How anyone could get 600 women to do anything is a miracle in itself. I can't even get my daughter to clean up her room.) But I digress... There is much more I could impart but I suspect you have the same mindset as other women I've encountered. The kind who doesn't want listen to the facts because you're mind is set and you derive some benefit from it being so. I will submit that the core founding idea of my group is that I'm, and many others, are very concerned about how we are raising our boys. The newer generations of boys think they have less stake in their country because of the way they are being treated. Even though over 64% of college students are women they still receive benefits and support as though they are a downtrodden minority. It is also true that there are more men in their 30s living at home than any other time in our history. My concern is that when the next Hitler surfaces, which is likely because of the ego-centric way we raise our boys, their won't be another Churchill to take up the challenge to defeat him. My fear is that when the next Churchill, if their is one, calls out the Dogs of War they'll all be slouching on their parents couch with no intentions of fighting for a society that has lowered their status and in some cases such as yours mocked them. The bottom line is that more young men die defending their country than any other group combined. If our society continues to raise our boys the way we do and treat them with contempt who will protect us, the Women's Chamber of Commerce? I assume your last comment about The Churchill Centre South Texas was an attempt to be snide and not an attempt to insult me or the fine folks who are members and supporters of our Centre. If you're interested to learn more go to www.northernkingdom.us where you will see my books and links to other pages. Sincerely and most respectfully, jim James (Jim) T. Slattery Founder, The Churchill Centre South Texas 2803 Red River Creek San Antonio, TX 78259 Mobile: 210-601-2143 [email protected] www.thechurchillcentresouthtexas.com This was in response to my posting: From: Carol Mueller <[email protected]> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 10:58:39 -0700 (PDT) Local: Wed, Apr 22 2009 10:58 am Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Book Recommendation Reply | Reply to author | Forward | Print | Individual message | Show original | Remove | Report this message | Find messages by this author Dear Manly Man, I don't think Churchill is your man! He went weak-kneed at the sight of a beautiful or intelligent woman. He cried copiously and was terrifically sentimental. He married a strong, (not to say 'manly') woman and 'lived happily ever-after.' He was masculine without being hateful of anyone ('except Hitler, and that was strictly professional...') and overall is a poor roll-model for your group. His overall positive attitude comes out in all his written works and could deflect your group from its purpose. Although I have not been able to offer you a recommendation, I see that many other Churchillians have stepped up and provided you with assistance. So, carry on, soldier! p.s. Are women allowed in your Churchill Centre South Texas? My Apologia— Dear Sir, 1-I tried to explain in my response why I was offended and did apologize for any offense given on my part in my April 23 post (which I have pasted below) hoping to end this sorry thread. I tried to show that Churchill (who I think exemplifies manhood and I erred in assuming that anyone would understand that), in contrast to your bent, did not need to flaunt his masculinity or subdue his 'feminine' side or was threatened by women. He was his own man so to say. Your message just explains what generates the underlying insecurity I sensed that drives your mission. 2-I am not a Ms. but a Mrs. I am a senior disabled citizen who respects men especially the Winston Churchill kind and have a very open mind. 3- By the way, neo-Hitlers have already arisen. I have raised three sons who are willing and able to stand up for themselves and our country as have countless other women with and without husbands. That men and women today are raising strong patriots is easily verified by acknowledging and appreciating our troops on active duty and recent and past veterans. I venture to say you are trapped in some feminazi time-warp. We ARE raising our sons to have 'the right stuff.' 4-I am not threatened by your approach, I just don't agree with it or think it is necessary and myself have never belonged to a group which excludes anyone based on gender, race, creed or color for whatever good intentions or comic affect. Besides, your list of excluding organizations doesn't make it right or justify your reaction to do the same. I do not know of any men or boys so down-trodden by women as you describe. I see loving men and women sharing life's challenges and relying on mutual support. Churchill quoted these lines from Rule, Britannia: 'Blest Isle, with matchless beauty crowned and manly hearts to guard the fair...' (Triumph and Tragedy, page 26). Churchill was a romantic in the best sense of the word and so are the strong and brave men I am proud to call friends.
5-You scoff at the idea of 600 women acting in unison and mock 'The Women's Chamber of Commerce' yet label me snide, mocking and a potential insulter. You complain of your daughter ignoring you among other female based frustrations and exude a feeling that you and our current generation of boys are being ignored or subjugated by 'She who must be obeyed.' Bosh!! Stop whining! You are, in fact surrounded by an army of manly men and boys who don't need you in your ego-centric view to remold them in your image. The Churchill Centre's mission of holding up Sir Winston as a role model is good enough for me. Carol --------------------------------------- 4-23-09 6:35am Let me make myself perfectly clear: Sir Winston Churchill was a manly, masculine man who was a gentleman of great power yet capable of possessing some of those 'female' characteristics not appreciated and apparently feared by the founder of www.he-manwomanhaters-club.net It is the difference between a juvenile 'rascal' and a mature man who is a gentleman and respectful of all. I tried to be satirical as I hope the website is intended and I understand the need for male-bonding and a book club just shouts out manliness; but as Freud would say there must be some underlying insecurity. I intended no one to wear lipstick who was not a female pit-bull! Please accept my apology if I was offensive also--I tried to be a lady. Carol Lea Mueller --- On Tue, 8/10/10, Editor/Finest Hour <[email protected]> wrote: From: Editor/Finest Hour <[email protected]> Subject: [ChurchillChat] Re: Churchill mentioned in an article on "man-caves" To: "ChurchillChat" <[email protected]> Date: Tuesday, August 10, 2010, 1:44 PM See also "Churchill as Manly Man," Finest Hour 143, Summer 2009, p62. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en.
