And thanks to Churchill's private agreement with Stalin, Greece was kept free of Soviet domination.
Re Austria, the Soviets agreed to leave their occupation zone because the West agreed to its neutralization, and they (the Soviets) agreed to this in 1955, two years after Stalin died. CES ----- Original Message ----- From: "Anthony Calabrese" <[email protected]> To: "List Churchill" <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 6:51:26 AM Subject: RE: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt I would also point out that the West was at least able to get Stalin to sign something about free elections. True he ignored it, but it was the best the western leaders could do. WSC did ask the Imperial general staff to review military options ("Operation Unthinkable"). Even with the use of US, British and Polish troops AND rearming some Germans, the result was a finding that a military option was impossible. And let's not forget that the West was at least able to to get the Soviets to evacuate Austria and Iran and that Yugoslavia and Finland were kept free of Soviet troops. Sometimes you take you victories where you can get them. Anthony Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 10:19:02 +0000 From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt I concur 100% with that. Stalin did make chumps of FDR and WSC, especially FDR, who was a death's door at the time (Yalta). My point is that it would not have made much difference if he hadn't, that is, if FDR & WSC had stood up to him. Stalin could have refused to collaborate in defeating Japan, but it would not have been in his interest to refuse (remember this was before the A-bomb), and the Berlin blockade could have taken place 3 years earlier. (Would the USA & the UK have been willing to attempt the airlift in summer 1945, so soon after having spent so much blood and treasure fighting the Germans?) Another factor - there was considerable sympathy for the Russians in the west for the the terrible devastation that the Nazis had wrought in the USSR. CES ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 12:27:44 AM Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt I didn't say they should have taken military action - that would have been obviously impossible. The electorate in neither Britain or America would have stood for it. But there was leverage. We'll probably never know the full impact of Lend Lease on Russia, but it was significant. Stalin was always afraid that Britain/United States would cut a deal with Hitler - just as WSC/FDR were afraid Stalin would do. Britain went to war over Poland - and then abandoned them. All of which is irrelevant. The article's point is that Stalin made chumps out of both WSC and FDR. I think the author makes a good case. Jonathan Hayes --- On Mon, 1/3/11, Carey Stronach <[email protected]> wrote: From: Carey Stronach <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt To: [email protected] Date: Monday, January 3, 2011, 8:43 PM What else could FDR and WSC do, start World War III just as World War II was ending? And how about the war in Asia? The atomic bomb had not been built and tested at this time, and they believed they needed Soviet help to defeat Japan. CES ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Monday, January 3, 2011 11:34:57 PM Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt Stalin was going to take it, no question. But WSC and FDR didn't have to agree. Jonathan Hayes --- On Mon, 1/3/11, Carey Stronach <[email protected]> wrote: From: Carey Stronach <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt To: [email protected] Date: Monday, January 3, 2011, 5:23 PM Stalin also had the Red Army, with more than twice as many troops as the Americans, British & Canadians combined. CES ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Monday, January 3, 2011 5:51:48 PM Subject: [ChurchillChat] Stalin vs. Churchill and Roosevelt Check out http://www.historynet.com/stalin-the-puppetmaster.htm Basically, it proposes that Stalin was a far better negotiator than either WSC or FDR and so was able to get everything he wanted without giving anything up. I found it a very interesting article. Jonathan Hayes -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/churchillchat?hl=en.
