Den 11.12.2023 14:23, skrev Andrew Randrianasulu:
пн, 11 дек. 2023 г., 16:13 Terje J. Hanssen via Cin
<[email protected]>:
Den 08.12.2023 23:56, skrev Terje J. Hanssen:
Den 08.12.2023 12:50, skrev Andrew Randrianasulu:
пт, 8 дек. 2023 г., 13:57 Andrew Randrianasulu
<[email protected]>:
пт, 8 дек. 2023 г., 13:37 Terje J. Hanssen via Cin
<[email protected]>:
Den 03.12.2023 22:29, skrev Terje J. Hanssen:
Already touched this topic barely in another thread
https://lists.cinelerra-gg.org/pipermail/cin/2023-December/007346.html
But so many SW and HW pieces are mentioned around, it
is almost a full-time reading and study:
VAAPI, MESA, VULKAN, Intel Quick Sync Video etc......
I realize my aging hardware which is fast enough for
other tasks, needs some "AV1 upgrade", if possible.
But first I wonder, what is expected possible to do
(obtain) with AV1 de-/encoding on my existing 64bit
hardware:
1) laptop 2018: Dell XPS 13-9370: quad core
i7-8550U CPU (8. gen Kabylake) and Intel UHD Graphics
2) WS infinity: MSI Z170A mobo: quad core i7-6700K
CPU (6. gen Skylake), NVIDIA GeForce GT-730 graphics
A budget friendly first "AV1 HW upgrade" of the
workstation 2) if possible, would be to add a new GPU
as Intel Arc A380.
But the question is if this will work at all on that
much older (2015) Skylake platform with i7-6700K CPU?
I've seen CPU bottlenecks has been mentioned and that
Arc A380 is targeted at newer generations CPU ...
Extracted from the first wikipedia reference below about
Intel Alchemist GPUs:
* Featuring 8 Xe-cores, the*A380 supports PCI Express
4.0* and has a total board power (TBP) of 75W. The
graphics card is equipped with 6GB GDDR6 memory and
a graphics memory interface of 96 bits, providing a
memory bandwidth of 186GB/s.
* Bus interface A380: PCIe 4.0 x8 and for >=A580: PCIe
4.0 x16
That is, the keyword here seems to be PCIe 4.0 bus speed
as a requirement to utilize the Arc A380 GPU for HWA AV1
encoding (maybe also for other GPUs?)
well, despite so much time spend looking at dev process for
mesa3d I still do not know full details and media encoder
process. But isn't it like putting uncompressed frame in
vram (as long as you have enough of it - so probably n raw
frames between keyframe ideally?) let media engine chw on
it, pull resulting compressed bitstream out of vram via
pci-express?
So I speculate pcie bandwidth in itself will only matter if
you compress both big frame size and long keyframes, so dma
engine on card must constantly pump new raw frame data via bus.
I saw some mention of big (resizeable) BAR as requirement
for good performance, but opengl/vulkan IMO a bit different
because they send often big amount of tiny objects
(vertices) via bus for each frame. But may be default 256 Mb
in size bar feels a bit small for sending like 1 second of
25 4k frames (300 mb/s)?
Nothing would be better than that A380 does work with older PCIe
3.0 motherboards and CPUs and without too much decrease in
performance.
Then I got the following reply to my support request from ASRock
TSD regarding
https://www.asrock.com/Graphics-Card/Intel/Intel%20Arc%20A380%20Challenger%20ITX%206GB%20OC/index.asp
Skylake platform does not match the system minimum requirements.
Please refer to the below link for further information.
https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000091128/graphics.html
well, if you can get card for brief (two weeks?) testing and return if
it really does not work - it will be better than leaning on official
answer, IMO.
after all, Intel, like any company tries to sell you a bridge .....
Yes, they always want to sell new hardware and do not want to support
older boxes longer than required.
So I may give it try on the new year. The point is to get av1 encoding
to faster with gpu hwaccel, even if it seems to be limited to about 75%
speed:
Today I also got confirmed from MSI technical support:
BIOS of Z170-A Pro MB doesn’t have Resizable (Re-Size) BAR support,
the mainboard doesn’t support Intel Arc A380 GPU.
For the MB that support Resizable BAR(Re-Size BAR), please find the
Intel/AMD chipse
https://www.msi.com/news/detail/MSIIsReadyToSupportResizableBARReSizeBARForNVIDIAGeForceRTX30SeriesGPUs121336
I've also extracted from the following two articles:
Intel Arc Desktop Graphics Card Gets Requirement List:
Resizable BAR Enabled & Support on 10th Gen and Above CPUs
https://wccftech.com/intel-arc-desktop-graphics-card-gets-requirement-list-resizable-bar-enabled-support-on-10th-gen-and-above-cpus/
/We are supporting Intel platforms with resizable BAR and
will add support for AMD platforms with Smart Access Memory
as Intel Arc graphics cards become available for sale as
components. Motherboard requirement:/
* Full-size PCIe 3.0 (or newer) x16 slot
* Resizeable BAR
Arc A770 Loses Up to 24 Percent Performance Without Resizable
Bar | Tom's Hardware
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/arc-a770-loses-25-percent-performance-without-resizable-bar
* Arc isn't for older systems.
* Intel has revitalized the midrange graphics card market
with the company's latest Arc A770, which will make its
way into the list of best graphics cards. Starting at
$329, the Arc Alchemist graphics card brings GeForce RTX
3060-like performance to the table with Resizable BAR
(ReBAR) enabled, of course. But, without ReBAR or similar
technology like Smart Access Memory (SAM), it's another
story.
* With Arc, Intel recommends potential consumers make sure
their systems support ReBAR or SAM.
* In addition to testing ReBAR, TechPowerUp also evaluated
whether the speed of the expansion slot impacts the Arc
A770's performance. As a reminder, the Arc A770 comes
with a conventional PCIe 4.0 x16 interface. However, the
tests revealed that PCIe 3.0 is still plenty for the Arc
A770 as long as ReBAR is enabled. Furthermore,
TechPowerUp only recorded a performance difference of up
to 2% between PCIe 3.0 and PCIe 4.0, so ReBAR support is
more important than the expansion slot. Regarding ReBAR,
only Intel 10th Generation Comet Lake
<https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-comet-lake-s-cores-53-ghz-high-power-better-pricing>,
11th Generation Rocket Lake
<https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-11th-gen-rocket-lake-s-specifications-pricing>,
and 12th Generation Alder Lake
<https://www.tomshardware.com/features/intel-shares-alder-lake-pricing-specs-and-gaming-performance>
processors support that feature. As for AMD, SAM support
is only present on Ryzen 3000
<https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-third-gen-ryzen-7nm-launch-intel-cpu,39449.html>
Zen 2 chips and newer. So while Arc's performance looks
attractive and priced fairly, its requirements
effectively lock out users with older systems. Arc also
demands Windows 10 20H2 or Windows 11
<https://www.tomshardware.com/tag/windows-11> as the
operating system, so Windows 7 users, who are reluctant
to upgrade, are also out of the picture.
https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1165048.html?sid=1b9518b86afdcd1fa5e7710f16cd6893
not exactly about av1 in ffmpeg 6.1 but lists some components
you need for vaapi/qsv encoder on Arc 380 - also from dmesg
resizeable bar support is not essential ?
gpus today use their own memory paging system, so may be
this add additional restriction on how fast you can push
frames to them. ....
Also, windows and Linux drivers might differ ( I bet most
reviews are from windows land).
May be someone will post linux review of this particular
aspect of Arc graphics, either video or text ...
If this Suse Studio service still works may be you can
compose your own live image with all components required to
test that and walk to some offline place where you can
testdrive new card .... { If weather feels favourable enough
- we have around -14 C airtemp so I and my dog prefer short
dashes around and back to warm place shortly}
My existing Skylake WS 2) above has PCie 3.0 only.
PCIe 4.0
https://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Express
https://www.techreviewer.com/learn-about-tech/what-is-pcie-40/
Motherboards Support PCIe 4.0
https://www.makeuseof.com/best-budget-pcie-4-motherboards/
https://www.techreviewer.com/tech-answers/which-motherboards-support-pcie-40/
Maybe also information of interest for WS building will
be clarified within a week, when Intel release their new
"Meteor Lake, Core Ultra mobile processors(?)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meteor_Lake
References:
AV1 Encoding on a Budget: The Intel Arc A380 Approach
https://medium.com/@contact_45426/av1-encoding-on-a-budget-the-intel-arc-a380-approach-d72367f2f349
https://history-computer.com/intel-arc-a380-full-review-of-intels-entry-level-gpu/
AV1 fixed-function hardware encoder is included in
Alchemist GPUs as part of the Intel Quick Sync Video core.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Arc#Alchemist
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AV1#Hardware
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Quick_Sync_Video#Hardware_decoding_and_encoding
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