Hello,
I always like the view that you take exams to enhance your knowledge - that
is the goal. I think the goal of Cisco is to enhance the customer service by
having lots of competent engineers, because happy customers buy more stuff.
However let's not be na�ve, certifications also mean money. To be a Cisco
partner you need several CCIE's and CCDP's (depending on the type, gold,
silver...). Being a Cisco partner means discounts and other advantages.
There we are talking about money.
If you are certified you can either bring money indirectly because you are
competent, but also directly because of the discounts.
And from an individual point of view, I think that if your real desire is to
gain knowledge and understanding, and not career advancement or money,
learning by yourself without taking exams is enough.
To answer your question : Who gets ahead faster - the paper tiger or the
engineer who gained knowledge through experience and research?
If you are applying for a job in a Cisco partner company, I think the answer
is the paper tiger.
That being said, I think legitimate the idea of collaboration in order to
prepare the exams. If you are not aware of the kind of questions you will
have, just take the exam once and you will know. The only difference is you
will lose time and money.
Kind Regards
Laurent
>From: Edward Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: Edward Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: Re: CCIE Written Test - retraction
>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 23:43:39 -0500
>
>Let's not split hairs here, as I doubt Cisco is/would. I agree with Ed's
>last statement
>
>Cisco provides a list of topics for the exam. We can express our personal
>opinion of TECHNOLOGY that we think is important for a career regardless if
>it appears on an exam. Even if that opinion has been influenced by test
>questions, we still would not violate the NDA if we phrased our question
>and answer in terms of GAINING KNOWLEDGE rather than passing an
>exam. Relating the question or answer as it pertains to the test is a
>violation.
>
>Why not keep it simple - leave the fact of a test question out of the
>inquiry. Besides, what is the REAL goal of us being here - to pass an exam
>or to gain knowledge to enhance our career? (Seriously, ask yourself this
>question and you will gain insight to your career.) One may influence the
>other, but the REAL reward as I see it comes from the knowledge we
>gain. Who gets ahead faster - the paper tiger or the engineer who gained
>knowledge through experience and research?
>
>Back to the topic...If your real desire is to gain knowledge and
>understanding, how does mentioning the test in your post here have anything
>to do with this? Sure you want to pass, but post your question in terms
>and context of gaining knowledge, not passing a test.
>
>What is the difference between "On the such-and-such test, they ask what is
>the purpose of a subnet mask. Please help." and "What is the purpose of
>the subnet mask? Please help." I think either question would get the same
>response. The only difference is that the wording of the first question
>CAN be considered a violation of the NDA.
>
>Cisco CAN NOT include public knowledge in the NDA - they can only protect
>things that pertain to their tests. I think if we do not mention the test
>when we ask questions - even those requiring specific detail - we will
>still get the answer we are looking for, but without violating the NDA. I
>believe had Elijah Landreth, the originator of this thread, asked his
>questions without framing them around a test, we would not have had so much
>of an uproar and he MAY have gotten all his questions answered!!
>
>So how about this for a "policy": Regarding TESTS - don't ask about it,
>don't tell about it. Cisco provides all the information they want us to
>know. Regarding networking, let's teach one another all we can.
>
>-Eddie
>
>
>At 02:47 PM 1/14/01 -0600, Ed Moss wrote:
> >This does cause a bit of confusion.... I took the CCIE writen twice. I
>saw
> >the same question on each test. It was in the format of select all that
> >apply. After each test, I looked and looked on CCO to find the possible
> >answer. I researched each of the possible answers that I was
>presented...
> >and still was unable to find the correct "Cisco" answer. I do like to
>know
> >where I went wrong - how can I ask this, without violating the NDA?
> >I mean exactly where is the line that will violate the NDA. How many
>have
> >read version 7 of the Cisco Career Certifications Agreement? In the
> >agreement they make a very broad statent regarding "proprietary
>inforamtion"
> >that includes:
> >Section 6... "questions, answers, worksheets, diagrams, lenghth and/or
> >number of exam segments and/or questions, or any communication, including
> >verbal communication regarding or related to the exam..."
> >
> >In the broadest sence, I take this to mean, if it was on the test, we can
> >not discuss the topic as it relates to the test. If this is the case,
> >everyone on the list is guilty! Case in point, If I took the test,
> >and saw a question that is related to decoding the RIF, and someone is
>going
> >to take the test asks "how is the RIF put together." Under the
>agreement,
> >that would be confidential. Even if Cisco has previously disclosed this
> >information!
> >
> >Hmmm... even in Secion 8, Conduct of Business, of the agreement, "...
>shall
> >conduct his business in a manner which reflects favorably upon the
> >products, services, reputaion and goodwill of Cisco..." Does this mean
>that
> >if we work for a reseller, and a customer asks us to compare Cisco's
>product
> >X to Competitor's product Y, that we have to say the Cisco product is
> >better? I mean if we say that the competitor's product is better, it
> >dosen't "refelct favorably" upon the Cisco product, even if it is true!
> >
> >The above are taken to the extreme. In my mind, a violation is if I ask
>"I
> >had this question on the exam, what are the answers". Or if I say "I had
> >the following on my exam...."
> >
> >If someone asks a question, with the intent of learning the technology,
>and
> >not to just pass the exam, I will help where I can. Of course, the grey
> >area of violating the NDA is out there somewhere.
> >
> >Ed
>
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