Vanessa Thank you for replying to this post so clearly and politely - you echoed my thoughts exactly but I'm afraid I resisted the temptation to reply lest my outspoken English phraseology was misinterpreted! VBG
Annette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vanessa N Weber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 6:30 PM Subject: [CKCS-L] Making up an AKC Champion: investment, loss or other? Hi Terri, Here is my response to your post... You wrote: "I agree with the previous post. When we buy show prospects, and pay big money, how can you possibly recoup your losses from that risk if the dog/bitch doesn't pan out? Luckily, in the US it seems that most breeders I talk to will " guarantee " show quality to protect their integrity and kennel name." First, I think you are under an innacurate assumption. People do not, in general, recoup losses from purchasing show dogs. I can't begin to tell you how many people have 'lost' money in dogs. In fact, showing dogs in the US is usually considered an expensive 'hobby' and not a business. If you can break even three out of 5 years in this 'business', then you can deduct your expenses from your tax returns. Most people I know don't manage to do that. You are just beginning but as you continue, you should expect to 'lose' (your term) or 'spend' (my term) lots of money on handlers, purchases, testing etc. One of the benchmarks of a puppy mill can be (note, I said Can Be) a reluctance to spend money necessary for these things. My second problem with this paragraph is that I know few people who will guaranty 'show quality'. Certainly not when you are looking at young puppies between 8 weeks and four months of age. Many breeders won't guarantee a dog as show quality until the dog has done something in the ring. But then you will be expected to pay more for that dog. In my experience, for many breeders a puppy is 'show potential' and beyond that let the buyer beware. If you don't know what you are doing you may end up with an inferior dog. Many breeders, including those abroad, will sell you what they think they can get away with and if you don't know what you are doing or just don't care then that is your fault, problem or whatever, simply for being naive. This is not true of all breeders but there are more of those out there than one might expect. You write: "However, I am seeing ALOT of exports that in no way shape or form quailfy as show. Could it be the money they are receiving just because they are imports? Once you have paid all the expenses to get to the show age, you are into that animal for 3000 or better. If you sell as a pet, you will lose 1000, plus expenses getting it to show age. I think that is part of the reason there are so many " pets " in the show ring. I see alot of our homebreds far better quality than some of the imports in the ring today. I think some overseas breeders are taking advantage of the popularity and prices, and running with it." I know of Cavaliers who have been sold for over $5,000 and as much as $20 000. Some have shown up at the buyers door with heart murmurs, sterility and more. Some breeders have terrible reputations for fleecing people, lying to them about health certificates etc. You really have to do your homework and look at purchases as 'investments' in a breeding program, that require research (what have they produced, when were they last used, have they been cardiologist tested, have you seen the certificate). Unless of course the only thing you want to do is show. In that case seeing things as losses might be more realistic. In that case, however, dogs will have to be seen to depreciate, just like computers. I find it much nicer to think of them as investments for my soul. You write: "Lastly, I also think in alot of cases it pencils out cheaper to use a pro. Put the time, travel, hotel, meals, etc together, and then add up your pro handler fees, which can also be written off. I have done it both ways, and was successful both ways. If you have a nice dog, most judges judging the " class " dogs seem to be accurate. It's the BOB classes that the politics seem to be in high gear...." It depends on what you want? If all you want is Championship titles, and you can't or don't want to show then having a pro is probably the fastest way to accumulate them. If you enjoy showing your dog (or horse or cat or whatever) then this would be an investment in that process. Champion titles are all relative too. I'd much rather have a French Champion than an AKC Champion because the competition is stiffer. In the end, I'd rather have a dog that I enjoyed whether other people agree with me or not. Vanessa Weber Kenjockety Spaniels =================== "Magic Commands": to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=T%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL to start it up gain click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=T%20CKCS-L%20MAIL E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author. ========================================================= "Magic Commands": to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL to start it up gain click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author.
